The Illusion of Control: Navigating Fear in Unpredictable Times - Episode 149, S2

We're living in a world where it’s becoming harder and harder to know what’s real, what’s true, and what we should believe. How do you find peace in the midst of uncertainty? In this episode, we’re talking about the very thing we all grapple with—control. Or, more specifically, the illusion of control.

We’re joined by intuitive energy healing practitioner Elizabeth Furest, who shares a unique perspective on navigating uncertainty—something she calls the alchemy of faith. Together, we explore:

• Why uncertainty feels so destabilizing and how to shift your relationship with it.
• The hidden link between truth and faith—how can we trust what we can’t see?
• The role of fear in shaping our choices and how to free ourselves from its grip.
• Practical ways to ground yourself when the world feels chaotic.

Elizabeth helps us break down the myths of control, redefine faith in a modern world, and cultivate the kind of inner trust that doesn’t waver—no matter what’s happening around us. If you’ve ever felt paralyzed by doubt, struggled with making decisions, or wondered how to embrace the unknown, this episode is for you.

Key Topics:
💡 The Illusion of Control: Why we crave certainty and what happens when we realize we never really had control to begin with.
🌀 Fear & Uncertainty: How fear shapes our reality and decision-making, and why learning to surrender can be a superpower.
✨ The Alchemy of Faith: Elizabeth’s unique approach to moving beyond fear and into trust, even when the world feels unpredictable.
🌍 Truth vs. Faith: How to navigate a world where truth feels ever-changing and trust in our inner guidance becomes more important than ever.
🛠 Grounding Techniques: Simple, actionable tools to stay centered and cultivate resilience in uncertain times.

WORK WITH ELIZABETH FUREST
Visit elizabethfurest.com

 Make sure you're FOLLOWING Seeking Center, The Podcast, so you never miss an episode of life changing conversations, aha moments, and some deep soul wisdom.

Visit theseekingcenter.com for more from Robyn + Karen, plus mega inspo -- and the best wellness + spiritual practitioners, products and experiences on the planet!

You can also follow Seeking Center on Instagram @theseekingcenter.

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction
• 0:54 The Illusion of Control: Navigating Fear in Unpredictable Times

Transcript

Robyn: [00:00:00] I'm Robyn Miller Brecker and I'm Karen Loenser. Welcome to Seeking Center, the podcast. Join us each week as we have the conversations and we, through the spiritual and holistic clutter for you, we'll boil it down to what you need to know now, we're all about total wellness, which to us needs building a healthy life.

Karen: On a physical, mental, and spiritual level, we'll talk to the trailblazers who'll introduce you to the practices, products, and experiences that may be just what you need to hear about to transform your life. If you're listening to this, it's no accident. Think of this as your seeking center and your place to seek your center.

Robyn: And for the best wellness and spiritual practitioners, experts, products, experiences, and inspo, visit theseekingcenter. com. We're living in a world where it's becoming harder and harder to know what's real, what's true and what we should believe.

We talk about it amongst ourselves all of the time. And today we're diving into the topic of uncertainty. Why it scares us, how it shapes [00:01:00] our decisions, and how we can learn to embrace it instead of resisting. And to help us do that, we have one of our go to guides and SoulFam, Intuitive Energy Healing Practitioner, Elizabeth Fur We were recently talking to Elizabeth and she brought up a unique approach to navigating uncertainty, something she calls the alchemy of faith. What does it mean to have faith when truth feels uncertain? How can we shift away from the fear of the unknown?

And what's the real difference between truth and faith? If you've ever struggled with doubt, questioned what's real, or felt paralyzed by not knowing what to believe, this episode is for you. Let's get going. we're holding hands virtually right now. 

Karen: So nice to be back with you. Oh, we're so excited.

 We just are so in need of some of this clarification in this conversation.

Robyn: It just feels like now more than ever. And I want to say now more than ever because uncertainty is always there. We don't pay as much attention to the unknown and the uncertainty because is always existing. But it feels [00:02:00] more prevalent. And then this struggle between truth and reality.

And where fear plays into it all, it's just so in all of our faces now more than ever. 

Karen: Yeah. This idea of uncertainty, like you were saying, , is always with us. But I think because we don't have that anchor in whatever we think is the truth, because we don't really know what that is, it feels even more intense.

And I think the basis of this conversation is where we want to start with is how do you navigate? The uncertainty when even your own compass of truth and faith and all the things that are typically your foundation feel like they're on shaky ground. 

Elizabeth: And to both of your points, that has always been the human condition, To have to find faith or belief or trust in something other than The exterior realm. So the only place that leaves us with is our own inner guidance. But to your point, I think there's more information than ever being thrown at us where before, people might have [00:03:00] had only a few different pathways to follow, they were going to follow a religion or they were going to follow the stars or they were literally following a physical path in front of themselves.

But in our modern time, we live with infinite pathways. of truth, infinite options of where to put our energy, what to believe. And I think that is a really big question right now in a time of absolute overload that then becomes chaos and distraction, that how do we get back to that center point?

Like you said, if the compass is all within us. How do we anchor it so it's just not spinning? 

Karen: Yes. Because that's what it feels like. I think for so many, going into 2025, , there was uncertainty lurking everywhere. And then you have all of this Earthly mother nature stuff going on that is lack of control, We just recently had this plane crash, which hasn't happened in way over a decade, So all of these things that we think are just some level of control, some level of certainty, some level of [00:04:00] predictability. it just seems to be exasperated more and more. 

Elizabeth: I think it ties into safety, right?

It's not even just faith and what direction to go. It's also just the fundamental feeling of safety, whether it's an instinct or, something that we're adjusting to in a contemporary time I think now it's a different manifestation of ways in which we have to keep ourselves physically safe, emotionally safe, spiritually safe.

And how in a world where there's so much unpredictability, how to find that grounding and that safety. 

Robyn: That's right. When we talk about control, we've mentioned this before on past episodes, but 

we really 

do have this illusion of control. Because the truth is, we don't know when we walk out our door, what could happen, There are these Options that could be scary, right? Like you don't know when you get in your car what's going to happen when you walk down the street. However, I think your point with safety is that there is in quotes a normal [00:05:00] day, right? And so in that normalcy, we feel safe.

Getting in our car and, going wherever we have to go where we feel safe walking down our street. But the truth is, when I walk down my street, I don't know if a coyote is going to come out. it's not in my main line of thinking, I'm not putting it out there. And so this idea of safety is really key because personally feel just shaken, and maybe I still feel safe at the moment to go to the grocery store or pick up my child from school, but there is something that is not settling because there's so much being changed right now.

And you also, can feel the energy Around all of us, no matter where you live, because you can feel everybody else's fear. 

Karen: that's true. I think that I'm feeling that too. And I think one of the things that you said earlier to Triggered me in a way, which is this whole idea of okay, we've got this outside world that's going on.

But then we come back to this compass that we're supposed to have this inner compass. And I [00:06:00] think many of us can't help but feel confused or lost or uncertain about what that is. As well because of this energy that's around us, but it's really forcing ourselves and it's funny how the astrology of January is always talking about, going inward to really anchor, but I think even those of us who feel like we might have done some of that work, it may not really be working the way that we might need it to really be able to keep our center and anchor 

Robyn: us, right? It's true. What do you think Elizabeth? 

Elizabeth: I was going to say good thing there's energetic tools for all of this to help people to get centered and anchored and more in touch with the deeper intuition and the innate wisdom because in that space is the quiet, it is the answers.

And, even if the answer isn't there immediately, it creates the space and the grounding for the answers to actually come in, it creates an inner piece, even if it's the answers and still like a waiting period, because that's the thing with abrupt [00:07:00] change. And a lot of it, there isn't immediate answers.

So it's not about being able to connect a space and then, intellectually get solutions. Sometimes the work is to be able to hold in a quiet. Faithful and peaceful space. And then it's that inner peace that actually creates the energetic shifts and brings in the actionable steps of what to do next or what information to trust. 

Robyn: And I'm sure we will mention this several times, how important it's going to be for all of us right now, especially to find those moments where you can connect in and find that inner Take care. that intercompass connect in to who that is.

And we hope that we can give you some ideas of how to do that because we're going to talk about. What is truth? How do we decide what is true? Which is really the next question I think we want to talk about because there's so much right now. having me question [00:08:00] what is true and has been for a while.

Honestly, I feel like truth. And what I thought was truth has been really broken over the last however many years, and it's coming to a head I feel like I'm gaslighting myself. I don't know what is true anymore. What what do you think? And 

Karen: is there such thing, or is it something that is consistently evolving through this life experience that we have?

Is that the point? Is the truth of what we believe and how that affects the faith that we have in things. Is that meant to be an ever evolving thing in our lives? 

Elizabeth: And many things can be true at the same time, that's the whole point. There's not one. Vibrational truth of anything.

And I think the problem right now is that instead of coexisting and realizing there's many truths, there's a war for truth. There's a war for, what's the absolute right and correct way of thinking of being, of operating. And that has never upheld in nature. That [00:09:00] has never been a law in any way.

There are many things that coexist. And so if we know that it's multitudes, then the real work is within ourselves to find our own inner truth. And I feel like that's what we're here to help people. Learn how to do today is to have that power to decipher or to discern what an individual truth is, and to know that can be an ever evolving thing, but to stay in alignment with that true north to know what it is.

So even when there's external factors that are shifting that one's energy or thoughts or belief systems shift with those currents. 

Karen: that helps in a way, and I love what you're saying too about this idea of different truths can coexist, that's okay, as we're looking around and everybody's arguing about what is true, that it's okay and it always has been.

That has been the rule of nature from the very beginning that's their human right is to decide for themselves what the truth actually is. And so that helps me to [00:10:00] remember that aspect. And that doesn't necessarily have to shift my own inner wisdom or my own inner faith that everything will be okay too, 

Elizabeth: It leads you to compassion, when you can have your truth and someone else can have theirs and they can both be true at the same time, it opens the heart to compassion. And I feel like that is part of the tool or like the medicine of this time we're all being asked in a time of uncertainty to still be in a place of compassion for whatever uncertainty means.

 But that goes back to the war over truth how can we open up to compassion when there's alternative messages that tell us to close down and not have compassion. And that's where I think the confusion lies. But, I believe that instead of having an opinion on a lot of things or being in the mind.

Instead of going back and forth on what could be true, it's easier to just clear that spinning intellectual energy and go into the heart and sit compassion. goes back to the inner peace or the compassion and allow things to witness them as they are not [00:11:00] exactly how we want them to be.

Robyn: I think that there are those who don't even know how to find their inner truth. how do you start to do that? 

Elizabeth: , so that's a great question. And the way that I best know how to do it, and I think we've all had different levels of this experience, and it can come in a lot of different ways.

It can be just a deep sense of knowing. Or it can sometimes be like information that comes in really quickly and suddenly what people call a download where you're like, Oh, my gosh, I just know this to be true. And you vibrationally feel it in your body. Some people have a knowing It shows up as clairvoyant knowing so it's a picture people will see what their truth is in picture or in color.

And, other people have other senses around it, they might hear messages and be clair audience. So the way that we follow our inner wisdom can manifest in a lot of different ways. Sensory experiences, the way that I just know how to do it best is to truly quiet and it's quieting the analytical mind.

So it's quieting thoughts and then setting the body [00:12:00] energetically and a peaceful or almost like a restful state. Like right before bed, if there's no other stimulation and asking that all the thoughts and opinions of the day to leave the mind and then to go quiet and even ask your inner self.

Show me my divine wisdom or show me my divine light. And just by holding that intention, you get more in touch with your own spiritual energy. then any questions that you may have or anything you might be seeking on is in that space when you ask to just be shown your own divine light. And it's really quite that simple, but it's taking the time to create a quiet space because in the world that we live in, there's not many moments in most people's days that aren't being infiltrated with other information.

Because again, it goes back to the war over like who has the largest voice or, what information is true. So the only way to get to that inner wisdom is to ask everything to quiet down. It's basically like putting the world on mute and then going within yourself and saying, okay, you have center stage.

Let me hear the truth. And then to not [00:13:00] judge that. this is a really big piece of it to believe what you hear. And I would say most people can access their inner truth, no problem, but they might block it. Because they don't trust it. So it's a three part tool to find the quiet space, to ask to see your divine truth, and then to trust what or hear or sense.

Karen: I feel like that's the hardest part for people, Absolutely. Yeah. But the more you can practice that, even take a note of what comes and keep track of that 

Robyn: that one's really helpful. I love that. The find, ask, and believe, 

find the quiet space, ask yourself to show your divine wisdom and divine light, and then believe whatever you get, whether it's a knowing, whether it's an image, you hear something. I love that you bring up doing it before bed, and I would also encourage people, even if it's in the middle of the day.

Elizabeth: Oh, sure. 

Robyn: Multiple 

Elizabeth: times a day. 

Robyn: Exactly. I do it multiple times a day, something similar. It is on you. Put your phone down. Even if it's two minutes, you can get things so [00:14:00] quickly. And I think that's the other part is people don't necessarily, who haven't done that, don't realize that you could just be there and you'll be surprised what comes. It could be a word, it could be an image, I get things like love, patience, sometimes they get more specific things, but there's a reason I'm being told that and you have to believe that.

Elizabeth: I love that. You're right. It's just, we all have that direct access to spiritual energy, to our own inner voice and energy of guidance. And it's just. Trusting that connection is there and available and it is a birthright. Everybody has the attunement. Some people They're more attuned or they practice more often, but it is available to everybody who wants. To hear the inner truth or from guidance that's available. 

Karen: can I ask from your perspective, because we always look to you as that voice of reason so many ways, because you have such a really amazing energetic perspective on things.

Do you feel Because of the strength, and the [00:15:00] intensity of the energy and the emotion and everything that's going on right now, do you get a sense that's, I don't even want to say it's like a test, but like almost that this is happening in a way. to force ourselves to do this exercise, Is there any of that going 

Elizabeth: on? Sure. I think the spiritual lessons have always been there. And for humanity, they're going to repeat until we get it right. So it makes sense that we haven't mastered it, or we wouldn't be where we are. However, I do feel that it's an upward spiral. It's an incredible assignment in this time to know.

Yes, there's all these multiple planes happening. There's all these different levels of truth. But in that truth, can we go quiet, find the inner wisdom and then follow it? I definitely think it's an assignment that's in front of us and very important and applies to everyone. Because this is a tool that goes beyond just spiritual wisdom and asking for spiritual information sometimes it's a larger question of who am I and what's my [00:16:00] purpose?

But this is the same tool of what's the safest route to get to work today? This is a tool that can be applied to all things. So in a time where we can't control so much, we can still go within ourselves and trust. Our tools and inner wisdom beyond anything else.

So we're not even talking about finding the answers to unsolved global issues. That's part of it, but some of the application to this too is how do you apply it in your day to day life to have . The safest day you can have or the most prosperous day or just like the most aligned day.

And so it's being tapped into spirit all the time because that actually strengthens. Your state of grace and the ability to move and navigate through this world because you're listening to yourself and getting that guidance as opposed to listening to all the other noises, and that is a place of Grace and inner peace and empowerment. So yeah, it is a larger test happening, but I also think it, on a larger scale, it's the best thing for humanity, because why not get people in their sovereignty, in the trust of themselves, so it's a [00:17:00] great energetic tool for all of us to be practicing.

Robyn: it leads also back to what you were talking about in terms of when you are in communication with somebody else. And when we were, talking about different people's truths being able to allow somebody to speak what their truth is.

And then, you can speak yours as well and being able to hear each other I'm trying to think how you avoid major conflict, is the right word, or maybe you don't, but I'm trying to think how we all live in the world right now. Where more than we used to, run into conversations or overhearing people, mistreating people, or, in our minds, it feels that way.

do you handle that on a kind of ongoing basis? 

Elizabeth: Yeah, that's a really great question. Because not about [00:18:00] avoiding conflict. , in a world where there's so many opinions or different just like manifestations of how to operate through the world.

Some that are, more respectful than others. when we see that sort of behavior It's like, how do you stand up for it, but still keep yourself safe? That is where 

Robyn: I'm going. 

Elizabeth: Yeah. How do you stand up for yourself and still keep yourself safe, but also not start a conflict and add fuel to the fire.

 And I think it goes back to We can do a lot energetically that doesn't have to be verbal. So let's say we see someone being disrespectful to another person, let's say in like a public space, which have seen in real life. I've seen it in retail stores. I've seen it at grocery stores.

And let's say you see an interaction of one person being disrespectful to another, instead of getting involved, which would Fuel the fire and start even more conflict, I would say energetically, you could do this physically with your hands or just hold the intention if you're in the space, but just okay, may this be contained.

May this incident, be [00:19:00] contained, may they be made whatever is not serving this argument or situation that all that energy grounded out right now washed out with a waterfall may be completely neutralized. And then, may there be compassion for everyone involved. And then may the divine truth of whatever is happening be brought to everyone involved when they're ready to receive it.

And, I hear how that would be a complex steps if you're standing somewhere and this is happening, but you can also just hold the intention of a couple seconds of may this clear and hold it in compassion.

Your heart made this clear , ultimately the divine truth come in. So it's it's almost like having a magic wand. Clear it with compassion, reset it to truth. I love that. and you can do that, just holding the intention.

So if you see something and you're like in a grocery line, clear it. 

Robyn: What I love, Elizabeth, is you always bring out our inner Jedis. You really, we can all walk away and remember, we have the power, 

Elizabeth: just be whatever the truth is, 

Karen: think that's what you were just making me realize is that no matter what, [00:20:00] even if we have the most loving intention for anything that it's simply our truth and everyone is going to have a different one that's going to bring their own life experience and emotions and everything else to it.

And there's something about. Recognizing that in itself that everybody is living in their own truth and it gets back to what you were saying before there isn't just one we must go back to what we always say the only one we can control is our own truth and really start from there and not feeling like we have to defend that necessarily to everyone or infuse that Belief into anyone else.

It's really simply the way we see our world based on our experience. And so once we can look at it with that almost simplicity, then it takes. the onus off of everybody seeing it in the same way because it's never going to happen. It never has. even that perspective, that just slight shift in makes me feel better.

And at least I can look at things from that. 

Robyn: And empowered, right? [00:21:00] empowers me now to go I believe, and my truth is that I treat others with respect. That is just. One of my truths that will always remain one of my truths we all have many of those right but just knowing that that is mine and no one can take that away from me is important.

Elizabeth: And so it's regardless of someone's viewpoints or their behavior, if they can also be treated which would then make you unwavering in your character. So if you're saying regardless of this person's behavior or characteristics, can you still respect on a high level that they're a person with their own opinions?

You may not respect their opinions, but you respect that they're a person, having conviction. Yeah. exactly. 

Robyn: I know that I'm doing that right now on a daily basis. I don't necessarily agree with certain people, but I'm respecting that they have their opinion. 

Elizabeth: And then you can hold compassion that they're also on their journey and maybe their journey has some serious limitations, but is that your job to show them the truth, show them the light, get them to see [00:22:00] it differently?

No way. Having compassion for them and saying, they see whatever their highest level truth is, or the divine truth of whatever the matter is, then they'll arrive or not at a different conclusion or a higher vibration or not, but it's not your job. You're just asking, may they get the information when they're meant to.

And you can't get people to wake up more. It'd be like going to a five year old and be like, why don't you have a, high school degree yet? Like you can't force something until it's ready to comprehend or to click in or to open up to that level of understanding. 

Karen: I still feel like there are so many of us though, feeling do we want to live in a world of that?

there's so much of thatness going on just in everybody's perspective, No matter where you fall, you're looking at a world, many of us are looking at a world that we just Don't like, and we don't agree with and get worse so this is really where our conversation started.

It's gosh how do you do this work? It's all the things which [00:23:00] are wonderful exercises, which do make you feel better. But There's this yeah, butness of what we're talking about, which is the so called reality that we live in this real day to day world and what we're seeing in the news and on our doorsteps in many cases is really unfolding and it feels so overwhelming and so disempowering because there's such a force.

Of energy in so many different camps. I love these exercises they're helping, but I think so many of us are feeling this sense of disempowerment because of what's happening. 

Elizabeth: And I think the work still goes back to, if it's something that we can't control, all we can do is find a way within our own selves energetically and in our own lives, choose.

The things that offer safety and optimism and joy and, that's the only way that change comes about anyway. It's not surrendering into what others [00:24:00] are saying that the reality could be or what we're being fed as the reality. It's actually saying, okay, I see all that, but I'm going to actually choose to create a completely different reality, even if it's less popular.

Karen: Or if it's just my own reality, right? In a way that that is your power and that is your choice. 

Elizabeth: And I don't think it's avoidant. I think it's honoring it's like having a million different TV channels and then just saying which ones you're going to unsubscribe to.

They're still going to exist, but you're not tuning in and then tuning into other ones and creating even other channels. it's a knowingness that we're not alone, it's just we're usually the quieter ones because we're not actively fighting for the truth in a way that, it has to be center stage and all about attention.

It's like I feel like the way in which we're fighting for truth. It's a quieter space. 

Karen: And I think in our conversations, that's where we're trying to get to.

It's you can't help but react in some way with an opinion of what's going on, but then how do you bring it back to, yeah, let's not give it the energy. 

Robyn: [00:25:00] and if you are in some sort of confrontation or argument with somebody and your instinct or their instinct is to get louder so that you are shouting over each other, but , let's say that other person is really shouting and yelling and you're getting quieter, , to your point of having our reality and ourselves getting quieter in that respect, maybe at first it's escalated on the other end, but eventually it calms everybody down because like you're not going to scream back like you're just not and you're going to, come to a more peaceful way of having that, resolving, hopefully, whatever that confrontation is.

And if you can apply that to what we're going through right now, in some way, you can see how that's worked in your life. 

Karen: Elizabeth, can I ask a woo question? I love it. Yeah. Are there different realities really happening energetically, Are we in this conversation in an energetic can you explain that?

Cause I really think that the more I [00:26:00] walk this journey in life, I feel like we are living in a universe that is actually different. energetically and we as individuals are as well. What is your thought on that? 

Elizabeth: I certainly feel that there's, we know that there's multitudes and multiple dimensions and multiple truths.

It's not only like in space, but also in time just even on the earthly plane, time is different throughout the earth cultures are different, so we know that there's different and clusters and vibrations that go this way, that go That way. And so it's like a radio wave, it's finding a resonance. And even the history of humanity has moved through different resonances. That's why there's a resonance of a generation, you think of a generation that was born, in the 1920s, versus people who were born in 2000, those vibrationally Are different, even though they're still on the earthly plane, but there's different types of realities, so to speak of those human experiences.

So that's what [00:27:00] then puts us in the center of this, where what people used to think you could expect in life, which was the certainty piece of formula.

That went linear at an expedited path and all the way 360 around you infinitely as far out as one can see. So yeah, reality is basically this like 360 thing now. And the work is to just pinpoint like tuning in a radio wave or finding a color or finding a geography or finding your group of people, whatever that is, and just fine tuning your own resonance.

to pulse in that, to make your reality start matching them. That's why, certain groups of people move to certain areas. Then the residents of that town or that city becomes that reality. And it's like, how did that happen? It's the reality of that place in time is because of those signals clustered together.

So this is no different in terms of if I create within myself, I'm in a resonance and then I start manifesting in that way, who my friends are. Where I live, all of that, and that multiplies, and then you're doing the same. All those other layers of [00:28:00] reality are going to be in existence.

So that's actually the work right now. It's a highly creative time. It's a highly spiritual time. If we allow it to be and we don't get tripped up over, Oh my God, all of these other things are shifting around us. It's an opportunity for extreme creativity. Really. 

Robyn: I love that something in there clicked with me so much, that really helped illustrate this whole idea of why it's so important for you to go inward, however many times a day, and focus on what is your truth and what is your reality, because then you're going to attract in more of what you want, 

and that is where our own sovereignty, our own power lies. where you use that word avoidant, that's where I was going at some point, like I have in my own life, Stopped watching the news as much for a period of time not at all and now because of where we are, I've been listening to it more and more because I was afraid of avoiding all I wanted to be somewhat informed, and [00:29:00] I think we, to a degree, as a human and wherever you live you want to be a little bit informed, but not making that 24 7 reality, Your reality really needs to be what do you want to attract in and who are you at your core at your center that clicked for me that like when you said the 360 and where's that dot that I want to be that to me would be I would hope are each of our goals.

Elizabeth: Yeah, and I think in all of it too. The difference. It's the power to decipher of responding with compassion versus reacting with fear. And right now there's so many things that pull us to react out of a place of fear. That is the tactic, whether it's a natural disaster or something catastrophic or.

 Environmental or political or anything, even in our personal lives. It's if someone is going through their own loss, let's say we always have the choice of okay, react to the fear, which is how we're so programmed and all the messaging we get is to react out of fear, but there's always the choice to go quiet and [00:30:00] respond out of compassion and say, okay.

What is the lesson here? then affirming this is the best possible thing for me. And that goes back to the faith piece of then believing so much in whatever has happened and saying, Okay, this is the best possible thing for me. I'm on my most benevolent path. Or this is the best thing right now for our collective because it's going to open up another benevolent path and choosing that vibration as the reality because if it's an infinite amount of realities, we can choose.

Okay. to create a completely different one. We can make a counter culture or a counter belief system. it's undoing all of that programming, which is like truly, yeah, the programming of fear and reaction and what we were calling the alchemy of faith of just believing that even if our minds can't see it, it's believing that everything it's for our highest and best outcome.

It's truly the most benevolent. 

Robyn: So 

is that how you define alchemy of faith? 

Elizabeth: Yeah, define the alchemy of faith as being able to have the body and the mind. Centered and in truly a belief where it's like vibrationally on a cellular [00:31:00] level that regardless of what's happening externally or what shift occurred, that it's the belief again, intellectually, spiritually on all planes, that it's for the highest and best outcome that it's for the highest evolution.

Robyn: And , how would you specifically define faith? 

Elizabeth: it goes back to that knowingness. Complete and total knowing this. So some people they get a knowingness in their whole body. They just know other people will be like, Yeah, I can feel it in my heart. Other people will say I see a picture of it I can see that it's going to lead me to something better, or it's going to lead us to something better.

Some people like I said, we'll get like a clair audience message they might hear like it's okay, don't worry. Even some people will have a feeling of relief, so something really bad could happen. But if someone has a feeling of relief in a way, that's the faith kicking in saying, trust this process, trust that we have to go through this to come out of it.

And we all have examples of that in our lives where what we thought was terrible was actually a gift. And so that's the work of this assignment now. It's how can we lean into, instead of that fear, but lean [00:32:00] into that faith of okay, if we can stay in that place of faith, that it's all going to work out for higher level or for a more benevolent thing, regardless of what it looks like.

Robyn: Yeah. actually, one of my mantras is faith over fear. 

And 

when I get in certain situations where I feel tremendous fear, I will say that over and over a hundred times in a minute and it is medicine for me. It works. It does alchemize, that fear into faith.

And I think the way that you put that helps me understand why I even use that mantra, I don't think I ever thought of it as alchemizing fear It 

Elizabeth: takes just as much energy in your body. Fear takes up so much energy. If you're in fear for a whole day or even some, seconds.

people have literally had to run for their lives. Split seconds. It's so much energy to hold. There's so much exhaustion to be in fight or flight. So it actually takes the same amount of energy to just hold in faith. So people can say, okay, I feel fear, but flip it upon [00:33:00] itself. Like I'm going to flip the light switch from fear into faith.

It takes just as much energy to hold in faith, which is that alchemy of we all know the vibration of fear and how it rattles the body, but truly on a cellular level, but if you can flip that and say, no, I'm just going to be quiet and put this into faith right now and have a belief that it's all working and conspiring for the highest good.

that will not only shift the physical body and people will feel better and they'll have, less stress, which is less, dis ease on all levels. But also, it's if you're around someone who's faith based instead of someone who's fear based, like you ever sat on an airplane next to someone who's fearful versus someone who's falling asleep, totally fine.

It's a completely different energy to be with. So it's if you can be in faith that then radiates. And then if other people can be in faith, that's what goes back to Creating new pathways of reality. So if there's, faith based people who are grounding into, that everything's the highest and best, there's a new pattern being created.

There's a new culture being created. 

Karen: that's so helpful. 

The other thing to remember too is that you reminded me as well as that. [00:34:00] Fear is such a multitude of emotions, fear can be blamed, like all in that negative fear, blame, guilt, anger, all those emotions that just feel so bad, and the faith side of things is that place of, what if it works out, it's not even being a it's just making the choice.

For something lighter and brighter versus something so dark and potentially, desolate that we're carrying with us. So can be a really hard thing to do, but if you can catch yourself and really think about it, it really does help. whatever you contribute contributes to the greater in terms of all of that energy. 

Elizabeth: It's just hard. It's been a really long time in our humanity where it's the masses are conditioned or programmed or put into situations where fear is the, the more

 Dominant, yeah, it's more dominant. It's more mainstream. 

Robyn: I also want to bring up this idea of faith again, but to [00:35:00] point out. that faith does not need to be tied to religion. Because I think a lot of times when people hear faith, they automatically think religion, God, that kind of Belief and we're saying we're looking at faith more broadly.

Elizabeth: Oh my gosh, of course, like people have faith in their, sports teams, They're like, I have faith that my team is gonna, whatever. So yeah, it can be in anything faith can just be belief. It can just be replaced with the word of belief. Have a belief in a positive outcome.

To have a belief that things can conspire in our favor. 

but you feel it throughout your entire body. Make it a knowingness to have it as Something that's grounded through locked in Bulletproof that there's nothing else that can get in the way because you feel it to be true through and through 

And hopefully not delusional 

Robyn: I think we all believe we're an earth school, right? Like we're here for our own soul evolvement and so forth. And so to what you were saying earlier, Karen we face tests on [00:36:00] a daily basis. there are some that feel more personal and then there are others that feel like it's more collective, which has driven us to have this conversation today because it feels more of a collective.

Whereas you can talk to someone who will say to you, I've had a really challenging year. Am I being tested? we all feel it right. So having these tools really, should lead us to feel joy and love that is the goal, and however you can find that, so to the point of is it delusional or is it our reality? 

Elizabeth: It's our reality. Love and optimism and benevolency and, compassion and doing that all in present time and groundedness is absolutely. achievable. And it is a reality. It absolutely is a choice. 

Robyn: And I think that we use the question, is it delusional or is it this or that?

Because again, there's this deprogramming ourselves, thinking that we don't deserve to be happy and full of joy and [00:37:00] in faith rather than fear. It's like we continue to have to. 

Elizabeth: Because then that's fear standing in the way. That's fear asking if it's solutional yeah, it is how fear operates.

Like fear is the one that comes in with the voice of haha, but how do you know, like that's fear. And so that's when, there's more work to do because it's totally the alchemy of faith or the alchemy of belief is you can feel it 100 percent through your body and in your mind and in your heart that things can work out for the highest and best pathway.

Or for the 

Karen: greater good. And it's the nature of the world. back to that's why we're here. None of this is really new. It's we are immersed in it. I think more because we have this 3d information coming at us from every angle, which perhaps in decades and generations gone by, they didn't have that as much, but it was still there.

They still had the church view and the village view and the king's view and all of it like it was awesome. Yeah, 

Elizabeth: the weather gods, yeah, 

Karen: So it really hasn't changed. , it seems [00:38:00] to have intensified. And I think also because there's always been periods of time where we think things are safe for the moment, Like coming out of COVID. It's oh, Okay, let's point, the moment. Yeah. And then the minute it's like, Oh, no, here we go. Then all of it, comes back. And I think the hardest part for us as humans is when it puts that at odds with each other, when it puts families against families and friends against friends.

And we don't inherently want to it. don't think most of us do anyway, it's one thing if mother nature uproots us, it's part of living on the planet, we can almost accept in the sense of, these things happen and we just have to figure out how to deal with them as opposed to, just coming emotionally and faithfully and, all the things that our beliefs Are really the thing that's consistently, making us feel fearful because at the end of the day, we have to know what we believe and for so many of us, that's the biggest hurdle to start with.

We don't, we haven't thought [00:39:00] about it. We haven't really given us time to really anchor our own selves. And that's what I personally feel I'm being called to do all the time because I live in this 3D world where am in the midst of so much differing thought. And so it's forcing me to really consistently reevaluate what do I believe?

And that is my only source of control in all of it. It's challenging when that word discernment, I think that was another word that you used for earlier, Elizabeth, when that is the frequency dial that we have. To attune ourselves to what do we, in seeing all that, what the heck do we really believe It does going back to that, feeling of that's here with it. And that we do know I actually 

Robyn: think we should touch on discernment for a moment because I don't think we really defined it for people. you define discernment, Elizabeth? 

Elizabeth: the wisdom to go within ourselves to know what's the right path because again, it's not about something being right or wrong.

There's a multitude of [00:40:00] truths, but it's to be able to discern what feels To be the most supportive or what the divine truth is in that exact moment. So if you look at something that's totally neutral, like whether or not you guys want to hang out over the weekend, right? there's no right or wrong.

It's total power of choice, but the discernment is going within yourself and saying, okay, is this the most supportive thing? that I need, or do I need to spend the weekend doing something else? And there's no judgment to that. There's no necessarily a good or bad consequence, but it's using that power to discern that even things big and small in our lives to go within and to filter.

All of our decisions and our behavior and how we show up through what is our inner truth in that moment and it's not a selfish thing to say, I know we had plans this weekend, but does next we can work better. That's you just discerning whether it's listening to your spiritual energy or just listening to your body.

Or being like, Oh my gosh, this other thing came up. That might be the universe talking to me about this other pathway is what I need to do. And [00:41:00] it's being able to discern as life happens and things inevitably shift around us. Where do we keep putting ourselves in present time with the inner wisdom that we have, just constantly looking at that inner compass.

 It's a daily practice to work on discerning. 

Karen: Yeah, and keep asking the questions because that's how you'll learn more potentially. That will shift your truth, your belief, your feeling of safety, all those things it is. It's being in the game and continuing to ask those questions.

Elizabeth: And it's okay to not know. It's okay to say let me see, or let me sense into this, or let me go quiet. Let me arrive at the answer when I'm meant to. It's okay. We're all in our own journeys at different paces.

Karen: Sometimes I visualize you, Elizabeth, being that person, sitting up on the mountain top, just looking down at the earth and all of the crazy that's going on down below. What is this for you? What is this time for you personally? And what is your feeling How are you staying [00:42:00] grounded and centered? And is there a bigger lesson that you're feeling either for yourself or for us as we go through this time? 

Elizabeth: me personally, I do feel like it's a time in humanity that it is mimicking other times in the past that I either am familiar with on a cellular level or maybe in my own intellectual understanding of world history and events or maybe even past life.

 But there is a soberness of this time and a seriousness. to ground through this time and to not take it lightly and to really commit to the work that we've been talking about this entire conversation in a time of adversity or in a time where there's so much information and so many catastrophic events environmentally and, humanitarian and all of that of like, how can I be, in my own life?

The most that I can. And then how can I be in my light and then also be in service to others in that light. May I, bring a presence hopefully to people that brings more [00:43:00] understanding or inner peace.

May I offer services to people that allow insight or groundedness or just attunements to their own energy. And then overall, like in the collective may hold in this belief system that I'm here and others are here for a reason to help create these be hubs and create other pathways of other ways of thinking and being so we can enter into or create a world that can offer more light or more peace or more certainty or what seems right now alternative ways of being but over time could become the mainstream ways.

 And I really do believe with the right lens it's a very exciting time it can be a highly creative time because it can force us to operate differently or to take a different stance or to be more in our truths and again it doesn't have to be verbalizing this is my opinion on something but a truth of I'm going to align myself in How I live or how I spend my time the whole thing of seeing me on a mountaintop is, I [00:44:00] realized that with myself, which is like the whole am I avoidant?

Because I have lived for the last seven years and totally remote places Even now I'm in the mountains and I can go 15 minutes to town and that's like the closest I've been to a town in five years. but I keep always seeing myself even today I was like, man, I really just wish I like lived in a cabin in the woods.

And I literally. Living a cabin in the woods, but I keep trying to go to these more remote higher places. And so when you say see me up there, I have this vision of if I could just have all the supplies I needed for six months, I would do it. And I hope it's not avoidance for me. It's just what I need energetically to Do what I do. 

Karen: Just to answer you though, what I see, and it's not even seeing you on the mountaintop so much. It's the resonance that you bring to the conversation because you have that some separation from being in the city energy all the time that I feel.

So drawn to your wisdom because it feels like you are disconnected in the sense that you can give the [00:45:00] perspective of what that higher level frequency because you're living that in your day to day. I don't look at it as avoidance at all. It's just, you're tapped into that. 

Elizabeth: I will tell anyone to get more in touch with any wisdom, find quiet places in nature. It doesn't have to be, on a remote mountaintop or, far drive away. It can be a nature walk. It can be sitting by a tree. That's where I get 

Robyn: my wisdom. And this is how you've chosen to create your reality.

This is your reality. and those are your choices. And when people listen, the truth is we all can , people always have an excuse to say I could never do that. That's actually not true. 

Elizabeth: In all things. Yeah. 

Robyn: In all things. Exactly. So you have to also catch yourself in what you're saying to yourself.

And what do you want? Again, it comes back to truth. What do you really want to be true? Because if that was something that you want, you can take steps. It doesn't mean you do it overnight. But you would have to take steps in order to create that kind of environment for [00:46:00] yourself. And so I think you're living that.

You are living that. And it doesn't make you completely when you said avoidant. You may not be in the soup as much as other people, but you're still informed, you know what's going on to a degree, you're just choosing not to make that your full reality and live in the fear, and that is the ultimate example of what we're talking about.

And you're doing the work, right? You're doing the work for so many of us who are choosing and want to be on a different frequency than the frequency of fear. 

Karen: And we need to see an example of that sometimes, in order to know what that really looks like, or feels like, or sounds like but it's a resonance that comes from you that feels like fresh air to me.

Robyn: It does. It feels, and even Smells like fresh air. I know. That's weird. We're just gonna say, no, I smell it. I smell 

Elizabeth: it. That's one of the Claire's , when we talk about being clairvoyant, smelling like fresh mountain air. I smell it. When 

Robyn: Karen just said that, [00:47:00] that's totally right. And we're all in different parts of the country right now.

so it's possible, right? We can yeah. I'll walk our own walk and choose these other realities. And this, personally, is what brings me back to center, I feel much more aligned with who I really am after just having this conversation. I can walk into the rooms in my house later where there may be other stuff going on.

And still know who I am and what I believe and what I can bring to the table. we hope that's what everybody listening or watching can as well. 

Elizabeth: And that's it. That's the exact takeaway of whatever is happening on, any plane, whether it's Up down around externally, whether it's family, whether it's in another country, whether it's in outer space, because who knows to be able to anchor yourself in your light and say, wow, what an incredible time that I get to observe this.

I can be in my own light and I can still create a path regardless of how all this is going on and to [00:48:00] not react or to give yourself the time to react, move the emotions through your system, and then collect yourself and say, okay, now I'm back in my light because that is part of it. We're human.

we get emotions when we read things on the news or we see someone affected, by other policies or whatnot that's going on or natural disasters. But to move through the experience and then to come back. And even brighter light and say, I get to be here at this time, I get to create a different type of change.

So it's just to not dim down in this time, but to go brighter, 

Karen: I also think what I'm remembering to as you're talking is this idea that our truth and our reality is always changing like 10 years ago, I might have been a soccer mom living in New Jersey, and now I am, grandmother living in Texas, My wisdom has shifted, my truth has shifted, my reality has shifted because I continue to grow and move forward. And so I think, for me, what you just said helps me remember that. Even though this is reality right [00:49:00] now. I just said it. It's already a different reality, right? Like it goes so fast and it changes so fast.

So as we get maybe those feelings of being caught up in that, Oh my God, are my safe? Remembering that, yeah, things like this has happened before. And I'm still safe. I'm still moving through the experience and that helps to 

Elizabeth: that's super helpful. And . I love your example, like where you were 10 years ago.

Is that where you are now? And that's still part of your reality. But what is the reality starting at a fresh slate at this moment from my own perfect energy?

what is the brightest light and the most creative thing and the best thing I can do now? And it's just resetting that over and over. 

Robyn: that's the truth. That's the work, in quotes, of it, is you really have to do this every day. And you may have to do it many times in a day.

it actually is easy the more you do it to get right back into that flow and that alignment. And know that you're human, , you're gonna get challenged, that is why we're here, but you get the opportunity every [00:50:00] day to do it again. 

Elizabeth: And maybe it's just pausing and when things are chaotic or even stepping into a meeting, like I did this even before our call, I took five minutes to sit here and just quieted my mind,

and then I just set myself up and said, I'm grounded. I'm present for this. This is where all my energy and attention is going. And may I just be in my perfect light. And just that it quiets everything else around me down. And it just allows me to be in my light. And then there's no fear and there's no attachment.

It's just the universe witnessing itself through me. And I'm witnessing it back. good. 

Karen: Even just thinking how I always try to listen to, with this lens of, oh my gosh, what about, the preschool teachers and the emergency care workers that are just in it on a day to day, but.

You can feel that sense of peace that even just the breath of breathing in the light and just exhaling all the other stuff that you don't need. Whoa, like there I am right now. I'm in the power of just the right now and all the other stuff can [00:51:00] still continue to go around.

Me, but I feel that resonance that more peace as I'm navigating this little body through all of that experience and all that 

Elizabeth: it does help. and you can contain it to I'm my perfect light. And then I'm sure you've heard this on many other episodes or with other practitioners, but then to seal it in a bubble of light.

So you are in perfectly centered in your inner peace in your light and protected in a bubble and nothing can rock it. Nothing can interfere. Nothing can throw you off. Maybe continue, but you can always recenter. You can always come back. 

Robyn: Elizabeth, thank you so much. We have, I think, hopefully helped so many people look at everything going on in the world and in their own lives.

With a different perspective and with real tools, like you are so good at that. There are so many things that I've literally been writing down as we've been talking that I'm going to start applying to my life today that I know are going to help me as I continue to come back [00:52:00] to my inner truth and inner peace and continue to shine my light as bright as I can on a daily basis.

Karen: And I love the word that we started with, which is this idea of alchemy. I keep looking at it as like this big pot of stew, That we're continuing just adding things to and it's shifting and it's changing and we can put all these ingredients into sort of that pot that we can drink out of and that is always evolving.

And so that's where the faith comes in, right? It is that. Let's use what works for today and know that we'll find the right tools for tomorrow and tomorrow and I just love these conversations because I think it gives us that reminder that we do have everything that we need. We just have to reground ourselves back into it from time to time too.

Robyn: And that we have our own inner power that needs to come through. 

Elizabeth: And I'll just throw this in there for alchemy. It's. the highest healed energy you can work with, or the most alchemized energy that any of us can work with at any time, so people will be 

what is this? the highest healed, most alchemized energy we can work with [00:53:00] are three things. It's being grounded. So it's being completely where you are two is being completely in your own spiritual energy. So it goes back to what is it to just be in my own light? 

What is it to just be me? Authentically me. And then three all of that in present time. So it's being here in my own light right now. And that's all it is. And it's true in this moment. It'll be true in five minutes. It'll be true tomorrow. So like Karen said whatever comes our way, there could be more tools that get added.

Or, you could get more advanced with it. But Even to get more advanced with those tools, they're not going to come in or those answers aren't going to be available unless you're present, grounded and fully in your energy. Wow. Being here in my own light right now. Yep. 

Karen: we can 

Elizabeth: say every day. 

Robyn: Yeah. 

Elizabeth: And one person says it and they start with twice a day and then they tell a friend and that person says it twice a day. And then 10 people are doing it three times a day and it multiplies. That's where we get.

major energetic shifts across multiple planes. 

Robyn: We wish that for all listening. 

Elizabeth: Yes, Let's [00:54:00] all do it. Let's be here now in our own energy. Yes. Thank you. Thank you.