Seeking Center: The Podcast

Tap into Your Soul's Wisdom + Discover What You Were Born to Do - Episode 66

June 05, 2023 Robyn Miller Brecker, Karen Loenser, Jaymi Bauer Season 2 Episode 66
Tap into Your Soul's Wisdom + Discover What You Were Born to Do - Episode 66
Seeking Center: The Podcast
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Seeking Center: The Podcast
Tap into Your Soul's Wisdom + Discover What You Were Born to Do - Episode 66
Jun 05, 2023 Season 2 Episode 66
Robyn Miller Brecker, Karen Loenser, Jaymi Bauer

We’ve had the privilege of knowing Jaymi Bauer for quite some time. Some people call her a marketing mystic. She has led marketing for a huge range of brands, including Xbox and its portfolio of games, and Gaia, the conscious media platform – and she’s also a renowned inspirational speaker.

Jaymi now runs Vaquera, working exclusively in the sweet spot where the practical and the mystical meet - the place where visionary brands are born. She is the creator of Resonance Design, a catalytic brand-building method created from her first-hand understanding of what separates legacy brands from everyone else: a relentless devotion to genius and truth.

And she believes everyone is their own brand to shine their light into the world. We all come into this lifetime with our soul's wisdom to lead us in the direction of where to go in this lifetime. She is going to give you the tools to find that wisdom and discover what you were born to do!

Plus, we’re going to talk about that word resonance – what does it mean? And the power of energy, vision and what it means to truly GLOW.

After this conversation, we have a feeling you’re going to look at yourself, your story and your life in a completely different way.

You can find out more about working with Jaymi and listen to her TedX talk at

Watch her TedX talk now on YouTube.

Visit for more from Robyn + Karen, plus mega inspo -- and the best wellness + spiritual practitioners, products and experiences on the planet!

You can also follow Seeking Center on Instagram @theseekingcenter

Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

We’ve had the privilege of knowing Jaymi Bauer for quite some time. Some people call her a marketing mystic. She has led marketing for a huge range of brands, including Xbox and its portfolio of games, and Gaia, the conscious media platform – and she’s also a renowned inspirational speaker.

Jaymi now runs Vaquera, working exclusively in the sweet spot where the practical and the mystical meet - the place where visionary brands are born. She is the creator of Resonance Design, a catalytic brand-building method created from her first-hand understanding of what separates legacy brands from everyone else: a relentless devotion to genius and truth.

And she believes everyone is their own brand to shine their light into the world. We all come into this lifetime with our soul's wisdom to lead us in the direction of where to go in this lifetime. She is going to give you the tools to find that wisdom and discover what you were born to do!

Plus, we’re going to talk about that word resonance – what does it mean? And the power of energy, vision and what it means to truly GLOW.

After this conversation, we have a feeling you’re going to look at yourself, your story and your life in a completely different way.

You can find out more about working with Jaymi and listen to her TedX talk at

Watch her TedX talk now on YouTube.

Visit for more from Robyn + Karen, plus mega inspo -- and the best wellness + spiritual practitioners, products and experiences on the planet!

You can also follow Seeking Center on Instagram @theseekingcenter

Robyn: [00:00:00] I'm Robyn Miller Brecker, 

Karen: and I'm Karen Loenser. Welcome to seeking center. The podcast,

Robyn: join us each week as we have the conversations and weed through the spiritual and holistic clutter for you, we'll boil it down to what you need to know. Now 

Karen: we're all about total wellness, which to us needs building a healthy life on a physical, mental, and spiritual level.

We'll talk to the trailblazers who will introduce you to the practices, products, and experiences. That may be just what you need to hear about to transform your life. 

If you're listening to this, it's no accident. Think of this as your seeking center and your place to seek your center. And for even more mega inspo sign up for seeking center.

The newsletter at seeking center 

Robyn: We've had the privilege of knowing Jaymi Bauer for quite some time.

Some people call her a marketing mystic. She has led marketing for a huge range of brands, including Xbox and its portfolio of games, and Gaia, the conscious media platform. And she's also a renowned [00:01:00] inspirational speaker. Jaymi now runs working exclusively in the sweet spot where the practical and the mystical meet the place where visionary brands are born.

 She's the creator of Resonance Design, a catalytic brand building method, created from her firsthand understanding of what separates legacy brands from everyone else.

A relentless devotion to genius and truth. Today we're gonna talk about the word resonance. What does it mean, and the power of energy, vision, and what it means to truly glow. After this conversation, we have a feeling you're going to look at yourself, your story, and your life in a completely different way.

Hi, Jaymi. 

Jaymi: Hi, you too. Wow. Thank you. 

Robyn: what an honor and pleasure to be talking to you today. 

Jaymi: Oh my goodness. Pleasure's mine. What an honor, and our 

Karen: listeners don't know this, but we've known you for quite a while now, and you have come on such an incredible journey we'll be sharing. let's start with the TEDx Talk which we'll share with everyone TEDx calls you, the visioner for the visionaries.

What [00:02:00] does having a vision mean to you and how do you help people take a vision and see it as a 

Jaymi: business? Oh gosh. A vision is just an articulation of something that somebody feels as purpose. it's emotional for people. It's not just what somebody sets out to do. It's the work that they've been born to do.

It's what you're compelled to do and putting it into a vision is literally just giving it words. And the reason I do this with businesses is, it's fine to do things that are transactional in the world. It's great to make products and services that people just need, but those who are called to do something extraordinary and often they've had some version of the calling their entire lives.

And they can go back to their earliest memories. And I can actually see threads through their story literally from their earliest years when they start to recount them into who they are today. Coupling just, wow, I've got this purpose, but then I'm also blessed with this genius. And if I could combine those two, look what can happen in the world.

And that is vision. That's what I work to help people articulate. And [00:03:00] 

Robyn: the way that you just. Articulated that spoke to my soul. The words that you just used about being compelled to do something, Karen was, when we were in a meeting earlier, she was saying how we have this vision and I can't stop myself.

I don't have a plan B because I can't see anything else. And so the way you just articulated all of that speaks true to I know my soul and my heart and I Karen too. 

Karen: Yeah. And I think that the other side of that too is that the vision is the passion, but so many of us don't know how to take that and then translate that into a business.

Jaymi: Oh, it's true. That's really true. And I wanna say it's more than the passion though, I was at Microsoft actually at the time in the Xbox group, and they brought in these high schoolers from one of the inner city schools. And the talk was inspiring them to have purpose and vision and things like this in their lives.

And I remember getting on stage and truly at that point in my career, believing that we all have something driving [00:04:00] us that compulsion to do something. Follow that thread. There's magic in that thread. And this boy raises his hand, this young man, and he's so my passion's basketball, I'm never gonna be more than five 10 and I'm not even that good.

So what am I supposed to do with this? And at the time I was like, that was a good head scratcher for me because it's not just passion that is going to be the vision that you need to go act upon, whether it's building a business or creating a career. There's that magic when you find that intersection of that passion.

But then, as I said back then, the superpower. Which today I call the genius borrowing it from Gay Hendrix, the zone of genius. It's like those two places of investigation, your passion and then your zone of genius are gonna intersect and you won't be able to sleep then because you're gonna be so excited.

You just can't wait to do that work. Just 

Karen: really quick on that one, Jaymi, what is your definition of Zone of Genius? 

Jaymi: I do credit Gay Hendrix for this. He writes about this in the Big Leap. He talks about the four zones in which we live, the first zone being the zone of incompetence.

This might be me with gardening for some [00:05:00] reason. I'm just not able to create the beautiful garden I wish to create. Then there's a zone of competence and that might be me with cooking. Like I won't kill anybody. And sometimes it tastes okay, but you're gonna get the food that you need to eat.

there's a zone of excellence. And this is where we build our careers. We're really good at something, we get a job doing it, we excel, we get raises, we get promotions, we get stock options. Otherwise, all of that is known as golden handcuffs because one day you wake up and you're stressed beyond belief and you're empty and you're wondering, how did I get here?

How do I get out? How can I possibly get out? I have a mortgage. Look at this mortgage, look at these cars, look at this college tuition that I'm looking at. And you can't leave the zone of excellence. And the reason I talk about that is cuz us getting stuck is there's this zone on top of it called the zone of genius.

And this is where we operate almost on autopilot. It's just stuff that comes so naturally, natively, and not just easily, but like brilliantly and wow, we're good at it. And you could be doing something in your zone of genius, Karen. I'd be like, please teach me how you do what you do. And you're [00:06:00] gonna actually have a hard time breaking it down.

It comes that naturally to you. And you could try to teach me and I could practice and practice, and I'll never be quite as good as you. And if you're doing this is what I say in my Ted talk, like the sun goes down really fast. When you're endeavoring in the zone, you forget to eat, you forget to go to the bathroom.

You cannot wait to get to it tomorrow. So not only are you extraordinarily good at it and you love it that much, It just comes easily. Talk about the universe conspiring. It's like everything moves out of the way. Gay Hendrix has theory on why we don't live there, so that's worth reading. The rest of the book, it goes actually the sabotage and self sabotage.

 But it does exist and finding your way even for a moment to glimpse it. First of all, I do this work with my clients when they glimpse their genius. and I don't know if this happened when I said this to you, Karen, when you're doing it, if you could even feel yourself clicking to that it just feels really incredible.

And so that's where the glow starts to come back. It's like that ease and that brilliance. It feels nice to be that good at [00:07:00] something, right? It feels that good, that nice to be extraordinary at something and to love something that much. It takes a little bit of work to come back to it, but even a glimpse is incredibly.

Powerful. And then you match that with wow. Purpose or passion. I am so passionate about the environment, let's say, and boy, I have this genius for math and computing and making things work. It probably makes sense that, my vision's gonna put me somewhere in the sweet spot of green tech, let's say.

So it's a little bit mathematic, but it's a lot of heart, head, and heart. 

Robyn: And actually that leads to talking about the term that people use to describe you, which is marketing mystic, and even some of the words and the terms that you've already used 

let's talk about energy and adding that to the mix, how would you explain. Energy to people listening. And can you recall being in touch with energy or intuition as you were growing up? 

Jaymi: I reference this in my talk too. Nicola Tesla says, if you want to find the secrets of [00:08:00] the universe, think in terms of energy, frequency and vibration.

And Einstein says, everything is energy, including us. Everything is energy. We know this. Before we have words, even, we're drawn toward people. We're propelled by people we cry. When we, feel energetic connection. And my whole premise in my work as a marketer is that we feel each other and, marketing went through this phase of just digital.

Overdrive, like we lost heart and soul of marketing for a little bit there and to drive growth through digital marketing. It was like the stock market puts and takes and it was God. It was like upsetting to me as a storyteller marketer and I wrote this piece. It was like, good marketing isn't good just because it produces the right metrics.

Good marketing is good because it resonates with humans. Really good marketing moves you and it's not always with a better deal. That's not necessarily good marketing. It is if it's like timing and I feel you when a little nudge, but you know when we live so much in the head and we [00:09:00] don't connect in the heart, you're never going to create bonds that last, and that was my whole kind of premise with my work.

We know this is humans, our true loves and our best friends. We energetically feel each other. That's why they are our true loves and our very best friends. That's why, without even knowing a whole story, if somebody comes at us with let's say an accusation against somebody we love, our first instinct will be to protect no matter what.

We've got each other. I understand this depth of you, and I meet you in that depth. We feel each other. And so I was like, wait a minute, if we know this is true, every single human knows this is true. Why don't we do this in business? Why aren't we building brands from this place where if we can find that place of truth where we resonate that energetic signal, which you can't fake, Different words can come out of your mouth, but people actually feel what you mean. If they're in tune and because we're energy, let's come back into truth and tell those stories. Now that's resonance. That's like a beacon and. Therefore in marketing, you put those stories out. Literally that's currency, turning [00:10:00] story into currency.

So that resonates, finds each other. What I say is, what resonates congregates? So that's, energy is us. We're all in motion down to the molecular subatomic level and our heart receives, I would even say probably more information sometimes than our head and certainly faster.

And I guess your question, Robyn, was, back to the earliest years my original thought partner is my mother. My mom, who was a nun for almost 20 years. 

Robyn: Wait, I didn't know that. 

Karen: What kinda a nun a Dominican nun in the Catholic church. My, the writer, God, 

my teachers in my Catholic school were Dominican.

Jaymi: She 

Karen: didn't teach at St. Patrick's School in Chatham Township, 

Jaymi: New Jersey. Did she? No, ma'am. No. She was in California. In Oregon. yeah, she joined the convent right outta high school. And not because she wanted to, but because she was supposed to. Another thing I talk a lot about the shoulds.

 We've moved quite a distance from that energetic truth of us often because we followed the shoulds. And this was her first story of the greatest one. She, her energetic truth of her was to be a mother. She [00:11:00] knew it. Odd career choice then to become a nun, but that's how strong this should was from her father.

So she joined right out of high school and didn't leave until she was in her later part of her thirties, so almost 20 years. And when she left back in the sixties, it wasn't easy. To divorce a human in the Catholic church probably isn't really easy today too in the Catholic Church.

Much less Break your vow as a nun. It's a big deal. And she had to have written permission from the Pope actually. She had to petition the Vatican. So lots of courage to I think of all of that, like talk about energy. The energy that was mustered to leave, that she had to muster every ounce she could get.

And she almost exited with this like tornado almost. But it wasn't reckless at all. But it, there was so much in it and she became a seeker. Not that she became one, she was probably always a seeker. And so we were raised, my sisters and I having our astrological charts all done, thick books of our astrological charts.

We traveled to Virginia Beach, to Edgar Casey's birthplace or the museum [00:12:00] about past lifes, and channeling spirits. so my mom she somehow elevated to this understanding of what was simplest. And, we would spend, I don't even know how long, talking about a leaf.

And she would explain and marvel at what this was in nature, the genius of nature. And she was certainly somebody, people called her the dali mama. She was like, everybody's, Guru in a way. If you needed something, you'd ask my mom to pray for you. That's what everyone would do. so I think at the very beginning, like she and I, we would talk about the metaphysical world without necessarily vocabulary.

But just questions and feeling. And when I would get a sense of something or a feeling about somebody and I would tell her, there was always acknowledgement of, tell me more. That is fascinating. And just a perspective on life to be expansive to that level of whatever I was receiving, whether it made sense in these three dimensions or not.

And I have two sisters that are quite intuitive, actually. Literally are Sears. And that was always Yes. Tell me more. 

Robyn: It's like [00:13:00] fostering for all of you at that young age. Those abilities that we talk about, that we all have the abilities. They're just not always fostered I know for me, I didn't come to really understand that until I was in my thirties. I'm now in my late forties. Right. But if I knew that from the time I was a young girl, I think, listen, it's all on purpose, but that for you, you would see the world with such different eyes and heart 

Jaymi: and feeling.


Karen: talked about this too. I think our backgrounds are so similar because my mom Is Catholic introduced us to the astrology at very young age. We thought it was so weird. But it was that infusement of taking the religion and the spiritual and the metaphysical and really not putting a boundary between them of really almost taking those boundaries away to really allow us to look and evaluate life at that level.


Jaymi: If she ever was frustrated by religion, it was just that, the confinement was too tight. Not that the teachings [00:14:00] were necessarily wrong. In fact, there was a lot of inspiration, literally inspiration in all of that.

It was just too small. it's so much more expansive. And I think that's the blessing of what I got from her was just the expansiveness of this reality and then the encouragement to ask those questions. 

Robyn: Yeah. And I would think what was normal for you in the thinking and feeling and asking of those questions was not the norm and still isn't for many people.

I'm so glad you shared that and we wanna hear more, but it helps to really understand even how you were infusing so much of that even when you were, in your twenties and thirties and, in work and so forth. And when you look at the companies that you worked at, you were able to bring a different level of knowing and seeing to it that probably most people couldn't recognize where 

Jaymi: that, yeah.

No, it's very true. I look back at my career and I have had a lot of young people say, how did you do it? How'd you get into Xbox? How did you get into video [00:15:00] gaming? And then, Ooh, Gaia, if you're follow Gaia. It's so exciting that I was the C M O there. And I would come up with the same answer every time and I began to preface it by, I'm so sorry to give you such an uninteresting response to your question.

How did I get here? Because one, I worked really hard and I did a really good job, but two I saw the obvious. And that was so unsatisfying. People wanna know that you saw the unobvious, they wanna know that you saw the one thing that, had to take all these calculations that no one was able to actually do until they understood the math.

And I'm like no, I saw the obvious. And I think a big example of that is, So I led the launch of Xbox 360 into the US Channel. And when we did that, so the first Xbox was that big black, bulky console. And it was Microsoft's flight first up bat, like to take a swing. And we did okay, but we were third in the race of three, at the end of that generation behind Sony and Nintendo.

So Xbox 360 is gonna come out and they picked a person out of each discipline and took us away. Two years ahead of the launch, we'd shut all the blinds in the windows, all even internal meetings were very quiet. And [00:16:00] I had to build this playbook for launching this thing. And toward the end of the very, very secret time, I went to my boss, who's two ahead of me, two above me, cuz he was the only other one who could know what was going on.

And I said, Hey Bill when we go to sell this in to Best Buy or Walmart, these big, huge retailers target I wanna show them a better way to do Sony first, and then I wanna show them a better way to do Nintendo. And then I'll show them Xbox. And he's what? And I said, bill, they're doing it wrong.

All of them have it wrong. And the only reason, they're possibly gonna hear someone tell them that is for me to show them how the competition will be better, just to show that I'm not just after our own win here. And back then you guys, I don't know if you're video gamers or had any in your lives and you had to go shopping for them, but back then you'd go to Walmart and you'd look for video games In those little DVD cases. would be a huge run, 24 feet of locked glass cases. Yes. Of all the games. Sony, Nintendo next to Xbox. That's right. And then if you wanted a controller or you wanted to go get the console, so if you had to go to another aisle And then if [00:17:00] you wanted to try the game for that platform, you'd have to go find where that interactive endcap was.

And I said, bill, look at how many steps they're making people take. So video game consoles are like razor blades. You lose money on the razor, you make money on the blades. Same with the console. You lose money on the console, you make money on what you attach. And I said, for somebody who cares about attaching, you're making people work too hard.

So here's what Sony needs to look like. The entire 24 foot run should be Sony, all their games next to the accessories right there. The consoles right there, and the interactive displays right in the middle. I have to walk two steps compared to 22. And so I took in literally these, like back then it was foam core with these glossy, presentations.

And I showed them this gorgeous song and they were so confused who are we meeting with? Oh, this is Microsoft. And so I showed them, this is, I think you need to reset. And across the board, the video game category reset millions and millions of dollars of completely changing out cases. And it was a big deal.

And Xbox was made category captain for the entire generation. And that [00:18:00] was the generation that we came out and went from three to, I think we were number one, if not, we were very close. And everyone thought it was so genius. And I'm like that was obvious. Saw the 

Karen: obvious. Wow. 

Jaymi: that's incredible.

So yeah. Is, does it go back to seeing and marketing and listening and understanding the very, if you understand energy, I think you understand what matters most. a big thing I still use in my work today. What matters most, if what matters most is that Seeking Center

helps people connect with others, either in story or relation in a way that will lift them up. To higher levels of consciousness. What matters most is that you find reliable channels to get stories out there. Is that your storytelling is compelling. And quick to get and easy to pass along.

And, I'm just riffing right now, but yeah, we can talk all kinds, all day about what the website is and like what colors are and like, campaigns and this and that. And a lot of it is important, but if you don't get what matters most nailed, then the rest doesn't work. So you can call that understanding how you know, the energetics of [00:19:00] thing or not.

You probably could. I don't usually. But it's what's obvious and the language of all this just gets really simple. So how does that relate 

Karen: to, let's go back to the word resonance, cause I love that word. There's a frequency about that word that just feels good when you hear it.

How does that translate back to this idea of understanding energy and frequency and vibration, and then really translating that from a corporate perspective? I'm trying to think, how does that relate to a product and how did you get the consumer to resonate with that product? 

Jaymi: So resonance is a term in physics, right?

That refers to and I'll botch it. I apologize to anybody who's who actually is a physicist. But sound waves, energy waves, there is a vibration to them. And when you have one object in vibration that meets another in the same vibration, they resonate. So if you've ever seen a tuning fork there's a video on YouTube that I love.

It's a tuning fork with a ping pong ball right next to it. And the tuning fork is like 440 hertz, let's say. [00:20:00] And this tuning fork over here is 430 and the guy is pounding it with a mallet and nothing is happening. There's no movement on the ping pong ball that's resting against the first one. But once he takes another tuning fork at 440 and he barely taps it, this tuning fork vibrates and the ping pong ball starts to move.

That's cool. So when you come into shared frequency, then you are resonating. And I came to this actually by doing it the other way, trying to force marketing messages that actually weren't true into the market in order to get somebody to buy. And then they would come in for the product and be like how did I get here?

And it's bad business frankly. it was a waste of money. The cost to acquire a customer has to be compared to the lifetime value of that customer. And the lifetime value has to be, I would say at least double what you paid to get somebody in for you to have a good business. What we were doing was we were paying to acquire people and we found like this really sweet message that we thought was resonating with them, but the product didn't.

It was slightly off. And they would come in, try the product and [00:21:00] bounce. Yeah. And they never stayed long enough to pay us back what we paid to get them in. So that's actually bad business. And I've worked on subscription businesses my whole career and so yeah. I'm like, wow, if we are not building resonant brands, then we are driving unhealthy business.

It's that easy. Again, this is, comes down to such simple math year. The cost to acquire has to be less than the lifetime value and the lifetime value doesn't happen unless they stay and come back and refer friends and stay loyal. And they think you're so great that they're gonna pay a premium.

That's ultimate resonance with your brand, but you only get to it with truth because we're human and we feel, and you can't fake resonance, just like that ping pong ball. It would not vibrate off of that fork until the same frequency was hit. So resonance design, that's how I came to term it that way and the excavation in a visionary leader is frankly just the truth.

And I tell people, you don't have to do homework. There's no homework required when we're gonna meet, you just need to come very ready. To excavate and take some layers off. [00:22:00] That might be scary to take off, but we're gonna get to truth. And it's from there where, they often, they cry. They cry.

And I'm like, gosh, why does everyone cry? And one of my premises is that they almost fall in love with themselves again. And because they're so beautiful, like your truth is just so freaking mag magnificent and magnetic. And when you meet it again it's like all of us. And then when you're that, yeah, 

Karen: in the day-to-day world, we're all putting that armor on ourselves, right?

Yeah. It's trying to act a certain way, sell ourselves, with a certain demeanor or stereotype or whatever. And I think corporate leaders are probably In that world, even more than most, right? Because they're so responsible for leading so many people. So when you get to their 

Jaymi: essay, yeah, it's 

Karen: probably 

Jaymi: a relief.

Yeah. One of the most difficult things for a corporate leader to have is a shareholder, a board investor and of course customers and they're all blessings too. But if you find the ones who don't really resonate with your truth, they want you to be something else in order to be funded, in [00:23:00] order to buy your product Yes.

In order to give you advice, then you really are putting on a facade and keeping up with it. It's exhausting. Yeah. And in my example, in marketing, it's very expensive. It's the piece that people have made. It's where they find themselves with those golden handcuffs.

Wow. I'm not happy, but I make a lot of money and I don't know how I, whatever. And this is, my personal vision is to help everybody, not just brands and business. I just like brands and business because they have scale impact. And if I can get resonant leaders back in touch with that magnetic truth and that person builds a business of, those people out to customers who also resonate with them and they're doing important work in the world, that's scale for big ideas.

So that's my vision is to unlock that and people who can go at scale and impact the world positively. But listen, it's for everybody. Everybody is a brand. We call person buyers. Yes. 

Robyn: As we were coming up with questions for today, we were talking about that is one of your superpowers for sure, is helping [00:24:00] somebody uncover their personal brand.

And we all need that. Karen and I were saying you need that no matter what, because you walk around. If you're 

Karen: dating, if you're applying for a job when you graduate from college and you're trying to figure out, you're gonna meet that, new group of people, when you go out into the world it's for 

Robyn: everything.

It's not just in the workspace, 

Jaymi: everything. And when you're back in that signal, which again, genius. Yes. It's amazing. You are we'll get to glow, but like literally you're glowing. You are attractive. 

Karen: As you jump to glow, one question I didn't ask was, cause I wonder if there's anyone listening, thinking I don't have that genius level. What if that doesn't apply to me? What would 

Jaymi: you say to that? Oh, it does. You do. I guarantee you. And this is where, I think it's just really good questions that get to it.

It could literally be, I had one client who incredibly intelligent and always top of her class and it's tough to be there because you're supposed to be perfect, right? And so she was extra hard on [00:25:00] herself saying I have genius. Are you kidding? There is no genius here because nothing's ever good enough.

And, you could see all the places that she actually had endeavored and done extraordinarily well. But as I listened to her and she was telling me about a job she had at a veterinary clinic, And she turned out to be the one that everyone would say this family's putting their dog down today, so you need to go sit with them.

And she would tell me, she would sit with them and often just in silence. and let them have their moment of grief, and then she would ask them a question, tell me your favorite memory, or something like that. Very simple. For her, it was just a little thing that she did, and I was like, wow.

she's lost confidence because she's not the boisterous leader that would normally come out of that well-known business school. But she's the one in the room that takes barriers down. And she's the one in the room where these, and she would say these big, huge grown men, football players would be on their knees crying.

She was the one in the room who made it okay and comfortable that she could be there and let them do that, and they would hug her. And it was just so natural for [00:26:00] her. She did not recognize it as genius, but nobody else in that office could hold that space that way. And so she was building this company a sexual wellness brand for young women.

And she's, again, very hard on herself that she didn't look like this. Gen X C E O, who's going to raise all this capital. But I'm like, the reason you have all these women coming to you is because you are the one that listens to them. Any of their stories that get really vulnerable in this line of work, you call them and they just, so that's genius.

So we all have it. We just don't recognize it because it's so natural, it's so easy and sometimes subtle. And it takes somebody from the outside saying, oh, nobody else could do that. I love 

Karen: that you explain that, because I think when you use that word genius, so many people automatically step back and go back.


Jaymi: right. 

Karen: Yeah. Automatically, sign themselves out of that. But you're right, we all have that one thing that makes us unique and special that no one else can do. And I 

Jaymi: love that you see them. I love 

Robyn: seeing it. Let's talk about what GLOW stands for [00:27:00] then, 

Jaymi: Oh, glow was a gift. It just appeared for me one day. It stands for Genius Light and Original Wisdom. And it came to me after a day of mountain biking in Vail and it was epic. It was something that pushed my edge and so got my adrenaline and my fear going, but it was, ah, we did, it came down and we were sitting at a bar, my partner and I and had just left the bike shop where the guy who rented us the bike and took it back just wanted to hear everything we had done.

And he was like so amped up and and we sat at this bar and all the townies who work at these restaurants, I'm like, look at them. They all have a thing, don't they? Like they're all lit up. And you don't live in Vale cuz that's where you were born and raised. You live in Vale cuz you chose to live in Vale.

Like you're there to ski, to bike, to fish something. But you chose to live there. And then I would look around, at some of the people who are visiting. And they had nothing even close to the cloud on their cell phones. Like maybe trying to shake off a little of the [00:28:00] stress, trying to settle into their vacation.

And I'm like, wow. You know what I'm so impressed to be seeing right now people who choose this light. And I said to my partner, you know what? I think it's something we're all born into. It's almost like I could see us like Star Trek, down in that column of light, and it's, before we know we're supposed to do anything but love life or just follow joy.

And we are literally glowing. Have you ever heard a baby laugh and seen anybody around that cannot also laugh? It's contagious. It's just so native. And then we get pulled, like somebody's gonna pull this arm to the left because I should, to be a good girl, I should do that.

Or to be a good girl, I should never do that. Oh, I should graduate from a really good school. I should get good grades. I should be a girl scout. I should marry him. He's so nice. All the shoulds, I should take that job. Or, a lot of people that I know I should be a doctor cuz I come from a line of them.

And pretty soon we're pulled so far out of this column of glorious, golden, white, whatever pink light that I can envision. And we've lost it. And my [00:29:00] work is to bring you back into this genius, this light, and this original wisdom. And so if I can explain a little bit of where original wisdom and light come from.

I've explained genius. When I take leaders through the residents design immersion that people call the brand seance, we get. Deep, we go deep. Sorry, I just had a 

Karen: laugh when I heard 

Jaymi: that 

Robyn: they're very excited to go through this with you, by the way. 

Jaymi: Yeah. The brand seance. Somebody called it a brand seance

and it's true because, I live in Boulder, so if you come visit me and we go through residence design, we're gonna start on a trail. We're gonna get our feet on the earth. We're gonna get as close to the mother as we can and just tap in. And then it's coming back into the current of you.

You have to find your pulse. That's your current, that's the current that's been beating since you were in the womb. And that's the current that will beat until it stops. And so you have to come into this recognition of this finite experience you're gonna have in this body. And I ask you to invite two people to sit with you in your mind's eye for this session.

And the first [00:30:00] person is, you're very young. You before the shoulds. Before the world told you who you should be, you were somebody and who was she? Was she like three, four years old? Maybe eyes closed. I have you imagine playing and you're watching her, you're watching Little Robyn, you're watching little Karen and what's she wearing?

Are her knees all skinned up? Is she barefoot? Does she have shoes on? Is she painting with her fingers? Is she just sitting in a ray of light? What is it? And I have you do this long enough to where you really, literally I'm looking at Karen right now, it's just this yes, I'm remembering now original joy.

Yes, before the shoulds. And a lot of times it has to do with nature. Someone's climbing a tree or something and fingernails under the dirt. 

Karen: I just have to say, I'm literally on the beach My mom used to say, I used to just frolic up and down like a little sandpiper, I would chase the waves back in and that was my happy place.

So that's why you see me smiling 

Jaymi: like that. Yes. Because you could access it and you could see the running and you could see the waves. And there was a dance and there was a rhythm and there was a [00:31:00] game and there was a chase and people laughing like the whole scene comes to life and now it's like running this current starts to run in you.

So that's the light of glow. G l o w. And then the second person I have you invite is the a hundred year old you. Oh. And this one is at her end. this one has lived her life. And I say, look at her. Her hair is different. Her skin is different. But those eyes, the eyes and look at them.

Robyn: Cry. Now I'm gonna cry 


Jaymi: every time. I'm telling you every time 

Robyn: why you like, you can't even help it, that person exists. 

Jaymi: the person is right here, right now. Yeah. And she has something to say to you. Yeah, And you hear it in a second and you are so loved.

you are so important. And there's something about what you're here to do. You're genius and your purpose that she's going to probably remind you of. And so now you're flanked. You've got this little one in this light, and you've got this old one with this original wisdom, and you're reminded of your genius.

And so now you are glowing glow, G l o W. And again, this is just [00:32:00] simple and obvious. Nothing like literally genius about this. When people glow, they are attractive, they are magnetic. Oh. And when I get people back into this glow, I tell them, I'm like, just you wait. 

Just you wait that next meeting, they're gonna want it to go longer. Just you wait, let go of the reins, the right one's coming, the right thing. Like it's, you're now literally just attractive. You're like magnetic. Because that's how we work somehow. The mobs to the flame. Yeah. 

Karen: Yeah. And people see it in you and you bring that out in them, it's the thing that attracts them to you.

Jaymi: Talk 

Robyn: about you being in your genius, for you to honor what you downloaded You glow. And you have been glowing for quite some time now, Karen and I remark, cause we've seen you over many years now and transitioned from working at a corporate job and creating all of this and how your glow continues to just shine brighter.

You're in your genius now. You're [00:33:00] working on that level 

Karen: You attract that into your life. Back to the vibration and the energetic frequency that we're on. 

Jaymi: The law of attraction. Yes. Yeah. And I will give you this. It's hard, it's so not easy. letting go of the shoulds was one of the hardest things I've ever done, and I still have to do it every day. It's been insanely hard and people think you're crazy. truly, because now you start to do things that are against convention.

The shoulds are convention. I say this in the TED Talk. I say that, being different is actually dangerous in our species existence. If you stray from the herd, you are easy prey. To 

Karen: stop people from doing that though don't you think when you say the word, should you immediately feel a shift in frequency, right?

Immediately A should. Frequency is not the I want or I am. It's 

Jaymi: no immediately different. Yeah. It is constrained and it's like an ill-fitting shoe sometimes, maybe all the time. I don't know. Good luck walking very far or very fast. Or even, let's say just doing [00:34:00] cartwheels and skipping.

That's much more interesting as a life than walking, gingerly. But fear will keep 

Robyn: you in the shoulds 

Jaymi: Yes, absolutely. Yeah. it's hard though. It'll keep you in the shoulds to stop doing it, which is what I did. I had to leap. I didn't see the net for sure. Didn't see it much less measure the distance of the fall or like how much weight it could hold.

 Like none of that. And looking back now, it's funny that you guys reference going back a few years. I can see every risk I took as the thread that makes sense in my tapestry. Or I guess the tapestry is actually a net I just had to trust. And I've heard this, you've guys have heard this.

We've all heard it jump and the net will appear and it's yeah, you do it first, right? It's just not easy. But when you do come across what your genius is, I do think mine is seeing people I. Mine is visioning for visionaries. And mine is seeing the genius in both of you.

I love it. It's so easy for me. I get so excited. It doesn't feel like much, cuz all I'm doing is what I've always done, which is to see oh my gosh, wow, you are good at that. Ooh, [00:35:00] look at you light up when you talk about that. Oh my gosh, now look at everything falling in your lap. And so that's what I get to do.

But the best part of it is then you see it in you. And then that's the game changer. It's when you see it in you. And how can 

Robyn: somebody listening right now, what can they ask themselves to start to see their glow? 

Jaymi: I would do the exercise, even by yourself.

Somebody came up to me after the Ted Talk in the auditorium and he waited, bless his heart, he waited. He was the last one I talked to. And he said, thank you. I got it. And I said, what did you get? And he said, my old one. He said, I work in sound design and tech and all that kind of stuff and concerts and I'm on the technical side of making shows work and everything, but my old one just told me I need to be on the stage.

And he's he's right. Again, simple. He's making money doing all the sound design and producing and who makes money anyway as a musician these days. But he was standing so tall because he, in that instant, when I was just not doing my TED talk and talking about this thing [00:36:00] very quickly, he let it in and there it was.

And now that's just the start. Of course, there's a lot of work that needs to be done for him to actually make this happen. At home I think anybody can sit and close your eyes. And imagine your littlest self playing before you knew should, and sit and invite your a hundred year old self to sit with you and just listen and write it down.

It's simple. And, explore the zone of genius. What is it that everyone's oh, you need that? Go ask oh, you always do this so well, or, you're the one I come to when I need, and what is it when people come to you and they need it and you're like, oh yes, no problem. I'm happy to, There's no friction on that answer. Yes. these are just, three, I guess you could say data points, but three pieces of information that triangulate around your glow and pay attention and be generous with yourself there. Feed yourself there. Indulge yourself well there, and then watch what happens.

My bet is things are gonna start to go your way. My bet is you're gonna become very attractive for the right things in your [00:37:00] life and the right people. And this is gonna sound a little jarring. I've always thought I had to put a disclaimer on my work. Be careful if you go here, things might fall apart, but they're the things that aren't aligned.

it could be a relationship. It could be a job. 

Robyn: because you're becoming your most authentic self and Yeah. You haven't been living in that place. Then those other things do need to change. Yes. And 

Jaymi: you're probably letting go of a lot of your shoulds.

You're letting go of the shoulds. And that's where I just want to acknowledge it's hard. I 

Robyn: love that you actually have said that, because we're not saying any of this is easy, where some people may say, just attract it in, yes, you can help attract it in, but it doesn't mean that other part of it isn't difficult.

Jaymi: Yeah, absolutely. And we are, we have good muscle memory, our muscles know how to hang onto what's safe. And letting go is, our muscles are sometimes gonna wanna just grab it right back. That's okay. At that point, you just have to be gentle on yourself and that's why I say it's hard so many times.

It's gonna be hard. And it's okay if it's not easy. And even if [00:38:00] you can, 

Karen: To your point, J take it slowly and just recognize one thing, It doesn't have to be a whole transformation into a whole different way of being, but. So many people can't even see that one little thing so many of us think it has to be a big thing, has to be a genius of a different level of being smart. Yeah. And 

Robyn: I think that example that you used of the woman who was able to hold space for people she couldn't even recognize that in itself is genius.

Jaymi: Is genius. We built the whole brand around her. It was so beautiful. It was wings. It was gorgeous. , I promise everyone listening, you have genius in you, and you absolutely. Were born with extraordinary light. Which also exists right now. And the wisdom that lives in you from the end of your days to the beginning of your time is also right here.

Robyn: That exercise is genius and I can't wait to do it. one of the things that I know I'm doing on a daily basis is I'm listening to something that I've recorded. What I believe will be [00:39:00] where I am in a few years. Just more of what does my day-to-day look like?

Not exactly what I'm doing, but how does it feel? And I was saying to Karen that it feels to me when I listen to it every day, it is that person from three years from now, it is me talking to me. and it has totally. I believe helped my own frequency and my own energy.

And I believe in what you're talking about with that hundred year old self and what she's telling me now, I'm gonna do the same thing so that I'll be listening to my hundred year old self. 

Jaymi: Yeah. She knows a thing or two. 

Robyn: She does. And it really feels because we're so tied to this linear timeline that it is coming from the future, but it's really coming from 

Jaymi: the now.

It's coming from the now. Yeah. Yeah. Joe Dispenza gave me the best articulation or image possible for this understanding, that quantum field is, our continuum of time is usually this sort of flat, horizontal, past, present, future on the horizontal. And he took that same line and just pivoted it on the vertical.

And now [00:40:00] all that it is past, present, future is vibrational and the higher your vibration, the more you're able to access all of it. That helped me so much. 

Robyn: Yeah. I love that way of looking at it. Just that image in itself. It changes everything. 

Jaymi: It's all now. It's all now. It's just where are you vibrating in order to access past, present, future. 

Karen: Robyn and I were talking about this the other day too, about how frequency. Is like music, it's palpable. So when you're in a group of people, you know who your people are because of how you feel in their presence.

So you know that you're on that same frequency when it's oh, I just love talking to that person, versus who are they judging me? 

Jaymi: Do they see me? Yeah. 

Karen: And I think elevating that idea with people to just follow the frequency of how they feel. Yeah. 

Jaymi: Whether it's 

Karen: making a decision or being with certain people, or just follow the frequency that feels highest 

Jaymi: to you at all times.

Yes. And That's it. Energy, frequency, and vibration. And when you resonate with someone, you both feel it. And those are the [00:41:00] ones literally are attractive. They just come right together. 

Robyn: Yeah. Speaking of resonance bringing things back to that marketing background, do you feel that there are certain brands right now that are resonating more than others and why?


Jaymi: Yeah. And why? Oh, yeah. An example I use that everyone understands is Patagonia. And when I say, some people are gonna think you're crazy when you start to choose glow, over anything else. a good example. Yvonne Ard, the founder of Patagonia, writes and says in interviews all the time that he just never wanted to be a businessman.

the bane of his existence is having to run this business, but, He's in business to save our home planet. That's why he's in business. That's literally their mission statement. And when everyone else ran their Black Friday ads, with 70% off TVs and that stuff starting at 4:00 AM and that nonsense, they took out a full page ad in the New York Times that said, don't buy this jacket.

Yes, we would rather fix your old jacket than sell you a new one. And they even [00:42:00] closed down a really profitable business unit that was devoted to corporate branded apparel. Everyone in tech was going around with their Patagonia vests, with their tech company logo on one side and a Patagonia logo on the other.

And they did a study and learned that the lifespan of a garment that had a second logo on it was 50% that of a normal vest that they would sell. He shut the entire business unit down. And told because he's in business of saving home planet. 

Buy a jacket once, wear it forever. We'll fix it for you no matter what. If a jacket's gonna last half of its life because we put a logo on it, we're gonna not put logos on it anymore. Wow. They shut the whole thing down and basically sent a note that it was gonna impact their bottom line. They recently designated the planet Earth as its only shareholder.

The company's only shareholder is the planet Earth. Wow. they're a billion dollar company. 

Robyn: With the people that 

Jaymi: buy, they're resonant. . 

Karen: Cause it's real. Cause they're authentic. It's not just a gimmick or a 

Jaymi: tagline.

And so there are a lot of copycats. That started coming out and [00:43:00] doing things like, oh yeah, we care about the planet, like greenwashing all over the place. And it's genuinely not real. If you pull the veil back a little bit on the plant-based meat industry, you're actually gonna see the meat industry behind it.

Because they're losing market share. And so , now, they're developing their own plant-based meats and they're putting nice leaves on the packaging. It's just greenwashing and they're not gonna last because people inside don't care. And they're not getting the consumers who will, no matter what, always buy from them.

The consumers are only gonna buy from them if it tastes good enough to buy or if it's a good enough deal, they'll never stand by them no matter what. Like people will with Patagonia, if you care about the environment like Patagonia does, you will always be a Patagonia customer. Resonant brands actually make for really good business.

 That's one example that I give that most people know about. I've been part of brands that weren't so resonant at Xbox. We came out with this sensor called the Connect Sensor, and it was cool because it saw your body move and you could control with your body movements what was happening in the game.

So we said you are the [00:44:00] controller. And it seemed like we finally had our opportunity to sell Xbox to people who couldn't actually do great controller work. That would be elderly, maybe that would be really young preschoolers. And so I was actually leading the marketing team that was going after all of the kids and lifestyle entertainment products where I met your old company, Robyn.

And we worked with Sesame Street to, release a Sesame Street game on Xbox. And I was up on stage at the c e s keynote. The last one Microsoft ever did. With a little girl. We were demoing with Grover and Elmo and everyone was like, who is this? Don't tell me this is Xbox.

It's it was so ridiculous and it was, goes up as one of, the moments of my career that's wow. was a good try? We thought there might be a there, but there was just no genuine truth for that particular part of the company to go just make preschooler games.

It was purely a market opportunity. And I, I'm not always saying it's a bad thing to do. It was a good thing that we tried, but there was just no way it [00:45:00] was going to succeed. Anyway, those are just some examples of things I've actually done and seen, where resonant brands make really good business.

Robyn: And to your point, that feeling, even when you said Patagonia, and I didn't actually know to the extent, honestly, until you just brought it up, , that they have been willing and are willing to do in order to make good on their promise and what they stand for.

And yet, even when you said the name it invited a certain feeling of quality of purity I feel like I'm outdoors, the moment you say it, and I think the 

Karen: corporate, the logo aspect was really, That's a huge Stake in the ground. 

Jaymi: Yeah. And they sell, the nickname that my kids have for that company is Patagucci because it's so expensive, and it's resonant brands can always. Charge more, their quality's gonna be there and their following is gonna be loyal.

And they'll do things that other people think are crazy, shut down profitable business units and they can, because they're making such a good product that people buy all the time. And this is an example that is polarizing that I use too. Goop you love [00:46:00] her Gwyneth or you hate her.

There's not a lot of people in the middle. And it's wow, why? nt brands also have a lot of haters. And they think she looks ridiculous and, they talk about her like $6,000 hiking crystal necklace and all these things. And maybe there's a little bit of tone deafness there if you're going out to people who that just doesn't resonate with at all.

But if you're talking to people to whom that resonates, they just want to know more. And they don't just care about how pretty the necklace is. They wanna know what the crystal is. And tell me what the crystal does with you and when you're on the hike is when it's in contact with the mountain, and all of these other, her Netflix special.

That actually goes into, the vulva. Everyone's what is she doing? She's what? It's interesting and it's important. And those of us who think it's interesting and important are like, yes, do more please. Everyone else. Lot of haters. And she tells her team, there's gonna be those. All it means is we're doing something interesting.

Let's keep going. How 

Karen: important is it if you're a small company and you're just starting out to really do this exercise and think about what do I stand [00:47:00] for and what is it that makes me different? And how do I really stand in this truth of taking this leap in the first place of creating a business, but then.

Really wanting people to understand why you're different and how you're different in this 

Jaymi: way. Yeah, and again, this is where it's gonna be hard, Because if you get somebody, like an investor or a customer saying that they want you to be something else in the beginning, it's really easy to follow that because, boy do you need the money.

I'd say when you're starting a company, probably one of the most important things you can do is make sure you have the right people the right team, the right co-founder, the right first employees, and those who resonate with you with what your vision is. The hour, the quality of an hour of work of that person will by far out measure the quality of an hour of somebody who's coming for a paycheck.

And so if you're early. And you find the right people to work with you in the beginning days, the hours are going to accrue to so much creativity, effort, passion, all of that the juice. That's extraordinary. And then of course the product, really making sure we, we call it product market [00:48:00] fit.

The first thing is product vision fit. Like really is this the thing? Is this good enough to do what I want it to do? Is it just passable and I'm trying to sell it cuz I need money. Maybe a little bit of forgive forgiveness sometimes to do what you need to do to keep lights on, don't sell your soul no matter what.

And so product, passion fit gets to then product market fit and of course going to market as a resident brand. I say turning your story into currency. That truth, that signal, it's like a beacon and it's like an energetic beacon and people come in contact with it and those who resonate, come on. That's a great go-to-market. That's a great customer acquisition. And so then it's the through line from the first employee to the first investors, to the first product, to the, the beta phases and all that in to go to market and all the refinement of your campaigns. Don't lose your anchor.

Don't follow, like this campaign performed so well. I've done this one too. Wow. We gotta a lot of new customers in on this campaign. Let's just do more of that. But that campaign really isn't exactly representing what we do. And I said this at the beginning of our [00:49:00] talk. Those are the ones who leave and you just spent all that money to acquire a customer who will never pay you back.

That's how businesses get tanked. 

Robyn: We need so many of you. Jaymi, can you just 

Jaymi: yourself, the world 

Robyn: needs the Jaymi. 

Karen: we say this almost at every podcast. We're not taught that way. We're taught to really follow these more traditional ways. If you follow the money versus the form, it's like 

Robyn: this formula, this safe formula that people think works.

But in the long run, 

Jaymi: that's right. I say something and it ruffles feathers. But if you want to build a magnetic resonant brand, ignore the consumer. And that is marketing sacrilege. Everyone laughs cuz they're like, are you kidding? I thought we were supposed to be obsessed with the consumer.

And yes, when you're going to market research is really important. But when you're building a brand, ignore it. They don't know what your magnet is, your magnet's in, you stop looking out there. Ah, that's and start looking in here. 

Robyn: So true. Because [00:50:00] you're gonna 

Jaymi: find your people.

You're gonna find your people. And if you are just gonna build a brand in the image of what people say they want you to be well, and by the, that's the facade. 

Robyn: That's right. And, I know we're wrapping things up in a sec, but I'll just say that like on the journey that Karen and I have been on over these past several years and in trying to communicate our vision to investors who don't come from this way of thinking at all, it's nearly impossible.

And because we have such an anchor into what our vision, look into what our vision is, And maybe not exactly how it plays out, but the vision and we're very solid in that we are not willing to just change it because someone give us the money and people will do look at us like we are crazy.

Not just because of our idea, but because we're not willing to compromise on the vision. 

Jaymi: Absolutely. And knowing you too, the way I do your work comes through you. It's not just that you had a good idea one day and you have the brain cells organized in the right way to make it happen. It comes [00:51:00] through you and the second you fracture that line, it literally, the channel breaks.

That's why you can't. Yeah. And just take money to do something else won. 

Robyn: And what's so fulfilling is when that magnetism really does attract the other energy that is equally aligned and what we're finding and even knowing and being connected with you for all this time and even more importantly now it's all been about the timing then, for everything to come together at the right time. Cuz then it is easy. It's easy. There's no convincing anybody. It just is. 

Jaymi: That's right. And then we're 

Karen: all bringing, our genius light, whatever it is. Our 

Robyn: glow. 

Jaymi: Our glow.

Oh my gosh. Can you even imagine when we actually all do that? what I picture is a light bright. Do you remember the light bright? Yes. Uhhuh I've always thought this if every single human is a bulb, this is true. The vast majority are not lit up. If [00:52:00] we all lit up, what would we see?


Robyn: wow. Now that makes me wanna cry too. That would be magnificent. 

Karen: and the potential in every single one of us is there. Oh yeah. 

Jaymi: Plug in. And the plug in is here. It's not out there. It's literally. Here, plug in. Take the risk. All of us light up.

Oh my gosh. I want to see what we will see. I think it's the answer it would be like, wow. 

Robyn: everyone, needs to watch your TED talk which is up on Jaymi, which is j a Y M i B A U e, and take the time to listen and watch you and talk about vision and resonance and glow and really help them.

And hopefully today it will start the process. But really then continue that process of digging into their truest self and lighting up. 

Karen: Yeah, and 

Jaymi: lighting up. That's it. That's all we gotta do. People like literally we have a [00:53:00] measured number of breaths to take. And while we take them, if we aren't endeavoring to glow, it's gone.

That's it. That's all we gotta do. That's the Howard Thurman quote that I am the TED Talk on. Don't ask what the world needs, ask what makes you come alive and go do that. Because what the world needs are more people who have come alive. Oh, 

Robyn: wow. Thank you for being in your glow. Thank you for sharing all of this.

And for everyone listening too, you can also work with Jaymi by visiting Jaymi you can connect with her there. Yes. And we encourage as many people as possible to be reaching 

Jaymi: out. Thank you. Oh, I so appreciate you. We appreciate Thank 

Karen: you we appreciate you. Thank you.

Robyn: Thank you Jaymi. 

Jaymi: My pleasure. 

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