Seeking Center: The Podcast

Map A New Reality: Discover Intuitive Intelligence - Episode 65

May 29, 2023 Robyn Miller Brecker, Karen Loenser, Therese Rowley Season 2 Episode 65
Map A New Reality: Discover Intuitive Intelligence - Episode 65
Seeking Center: The Podcast
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Seeking Center: The Podcast
Map A New Reality: Discover Intuitive Intelligence - Episode 65
May 29, 2023 Season 2 Episode 65
Robyn Miller Brecker, Karen Loenser, Therese Rowley

Dr. Therese Rowley is a force!  There is truly no one like her. She is a business consultant, skilled intuitive, innovative educator, healing practitioner, and spiritual medium. For over 30 years, Dr. Rowley has performed thousands of intuitive readings and facilitated energetic healings for business leaders and professionals, as well as those on a spiritual or conscious path.

She's developed The Rowley Method of intuitively reading and healing in the quantum field. Her intuitive coaching and readings employ quantum physics theory to engage your energy remotely. And she facilitates healing and realignment through a process she calls “quantum entanglement.”

Dr. Rowley has a Ph.D. in Organizational Transformation from Union Institute and University, an MBA from Northwestern University and a Masters in Public Administration from the University of Denver. She has also done extended study in somatic psychotherapy and over 50 different healing modalities.

She's the author of Mapping a New Reality: Discovering Intuitive Intelligence. In it, she says there is a map of reality that lies within each of us, and when we can learn to use it, we can transform pain and persistent challenges into inner gifts and positive life purpose.

We could talk to Dr. Rowley for days. So this episode is packed! We're talking about intuitive intelligence, quantum physics, and as she says "breaking open the status quo boxes within a person, a group or a business, so they can experience an expanded reality – one where they find that they can play a nobler role in a bigger world than they could have previously imagined."

For more about working with Dr. Rowley, her books and all of her offerings please visit

Visit for more from Robyn + Karen, plus mega inspo -- and the best wellness + spiritual practitioners, products and experiences on the planet!

You can also follow Seeking Center on Instagram @theseekingcenter

Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

Dr. Therese Rowley is a force!  There is truly no one like her. She is a business consultant, skilled intuitive, innovative educator, healing practitioner, and spiritual medium. For over 30 years, Dr. Rowley has performed thousands of intuitive readings and facilitated energetic healings for business leaders and professionals, as well as those on a spiritual or conscious path.

She's developed The Rowley Method of intuitively reading and healing in the quantum field. Her intuitive coaching and readings employ quantum physics theory to engage your energy remotely. And she facilitates healing and realignment through a process she calls “quantum entanglement.”

Dr. Rowley has a Ph.D. in Organizational Transformation from Union Institute and University, an MBA from Northwestern University and a Masters in Public Administration from the University of Denver. She has also done extended study in somatic psychotherapy and over 50 different healing modalities.

She's the author of Mapping a New Reality: Discovering Intuitive Intelligence. In it, she says there is a map of reality that lies within each of us, and when we can learn to use it, we can transform pain and persistent challenges into inner gifts and positive life purpose.

We could talk to Dr. Rowley for days. So this episode is packed! We're talking about intuitive intelligence, quantum physics, and as she says "breaking open the status quo boxes within a person, a group or a business, so they can experience an expanded reality – one where they find that they can play a nobler role in a bigger world than they could have previously imagined."

For more about working with Dr. Rowley, her books and all of her offerings please visit

Visit for more from Robyn + Karen, plus mega inspo -- and the best wellness + spiritual practitioners, products and experiences on the planet!

You can also follow Seeking Center on Instagram @theseekingcenter

Robyn: [00:00:00] I'm Robyn Miller Brecker, 

Karen: and I'm Karen Loenser. Welcome to seeking center. The podcast,

Robyn: join us each week as we have the conversations and weed through the spiritual and holistic clutter for you, we'll boil it down to what you need to know. Now 

Karen: we're all about total wellness, which to us needs building a healthy life on a physical, mental, and spiritual level.

We'll talk to the trailblazers who will introduce you to the practices, products, and experiences. That may be just what you need to hear about to transform your life. 

If you're listening to this, it's no accident. Think of this as your seeking center and your place to seek your center. And for even more mega inspo sign up for seeking center.

The newsletter at seeking center 

Robyn: Dr. Therese rowley is a force. There is truly no one like her. She has been a business consultant, skilled, intuitive, innovative educator, practitioner, and spiritual medium. For over 30 years, Dr. Rowley has performed thousands of intuitive [00:01:00] readings and facilitated energetic healing for business leaders and professionals as well as those on a spiritual or conscious path.

She's developed the Rowley method of intuitively reading and healing in the quantum field, her intuitive coaching and readings, employ quantum physics theory to engage your energy remotely. And she facilitates healing and realignment through quantum entanglement, which I experience and we will definitely be discussing.

Dr. Riley has a PhD in organizational transformation from Union Institute and University, an M B A from Northwestern University and a Master's in public Administration from the University of Denver. She has also done extended study in somatic psychotherapy and over 50 different healing modalities.

She's the author of mapping a new reality, discovering intuitive Intelligence. In it, she says There is a map of reality that lies within each of us, and when we can learn to use it, we can transform pain and persistent challenges into inner gifts and positive life purpose. We could [00:02:00] talk to Dr. Row for days.

So we're going to be packing a lot in this episode around intuitive intelligence, quantum physics, and as she says, breaking open the status quo boxes within a person, a group, or a business so they can experience an expanded reality one where they can find that they can play a nobler role in a bigger world than they could have previously imagined. Hi there. 

Karen: Hi Robyn. How good to see you. Thanks for having me. Karen, we're so glad you're here. So much to unpack . I can't wait.

Robyn: Let's start with intuitive intelligence. How do you define that? 

Therese: First of all I really appreciate that people are asking that question these days because there was a time when 

intelligence only meant academic intelligence. Rational intelligence.

And since then we've learned that there are many different kinds of intelligences and often social and emotional intelligences are named. We can say that after Daniel 

Goldman's book, that there's, 

that was on the bestseller list for 30 years, emotional intelligence, that leaders are better leaders if they're [00:03:00] emotionally intelligent compared to if they're only iq, as in academically intelligent.

And so we know how 

big a role it plays in allowing us to be better leaders. 

What's less emphasized is what's underneath emotional intelligence, which is intuitive intelligence. And that allows us to access the wisdom that each of us holds as unique beings that we can then bring forward, both for our own wellbeing as well as for the wellbeing of groups and even companies and corporations.

So intuitive intelligence is really understanding the kinds of ways we know 

what we know so that we can better access and be at choice for 

What decisions we make. Instead of feeling like, we say, this is just me. No, this is you that doesn't know all the other kinds of ways that you can bring forward your 

Karen: wisdom.

So that's what that's all about. so for can you just bridge the discovering intuitive intelligence with mapping a new reality? Because when Robyn read the intro, I'm sure a lot of ears perked 

Therese: up when 

Karen: they heard those words, map the new reality. Like, how do I do that? So how did the two work together?

Therese: Great [00:04:00] question. I call it mapping a new reality because I think all of us live in a reality that 

sometimes we've been bequeathed by those 

who are in our families. And this is the way we do things around here. So our neighborhood works. This is how the kids we know do things. This is how I grew up.

This is me. That's my map of reality. It has boundaries. Oh, we don't do that. Or, oh, we don't go there. We don't talk to those people because we're us. So we've defined in us, and it's often a primal 

us that keeps intact, the group that we 

identify with, that if we act that way, that must be us. And we do that even in social media.

That person's the, hot chick and that person's a because of the way they dress and because of the way they talk, we know. So that's a map of reality. But we can map new realities. The more we understand our capacities to grow in different ways, to perceive in different ways, and to include really the understanding of different contexts.

 if we continue to live in the context we've always lived in, that's the world we always know. That's why when people say traveling is so important, we say, wow, you think that's important? Oh, you think that's fun? I didn't even think that was fun. [00:05:00] And then I did it and thought, oh, it could be fun for me 


So now I have a different context in which 

to perceive reality. If we do that from the inside out, we have all kinds of ways 

to know that we don't know, what we don't know, 

 and then we can actually bring that out and help share it with others, So the idea is to bring it from the invisible to the visible so that we can make choices, we can define our map of reality differently. We can include more. Maps of reality tend to be expansive the more we understand through intuitive intelligence, through the ways the portals through which we perceive reality, the bigger our world can be.

Why? Because our maps are usually defined by our gifts and fears. And the fears usually define what goes outside the boundary. Our family doesn't like them cuz they're scary folks and they threaten us by calling us this name and 

we're afraid of them. 

So there's the boundary when we see things in a different context. Intuitive intelligence 

helps us to accept 

the truth of what is that? By the way? That's their narrative. And this is just ours. And they're afraid of that. And I'm 

afraid of this.

I can heal the places 

I'm afraid of. And then that allows [00:06:00] me to broaden my reality, my map, and someone comes in and says the same thing and it doesn't land with me. That's about me. It lands with me that, oh, that's how they're afraid and that's what they think. Perfect. That's what the journey they're on.

I'm not there anymore. So in through intuitive intelligence, I expand my map of reality. 

Robyn: I just wish that we all learned this when we were much younger. 

Karen: Me too. Yeah, me too. Do we embrace of other people's beliefs that aren't even our own, and then we forget that there are other beliefs and they're not our 

Therese: own.

 And if you learn this in preschool and kindergarten, you know when kids perceive things, we, adults get scared, put them in a box. And no honey, you don't see that. No. You don't have to feel that way. No. It's okay not to feel, like we're them to narrow their map of reality right away according to our fear, we narrow their reality.

And so then that's how children become teachers, Because sometimes they insist on not narrowing their reality to our fear. And then we have to look at our fear instead of trying to get them to accommodate us. I can attest to that 

as a parent. 

Robyn: Yes. And take us back because , you talk about [00:07:00] being an old soul as a child and starting to have some of these extra perceptive gifts, which you may not have even at that time, obviously called them that.

How did that all begin for you and when did you know that what you were seeing or feeling might be different 

Therese: than others? I do address this in my book the beginnings of it because I do want people to understand that everyone comes to their understanding definition of intuition in different ways.

And so my way was that every person's way is unique. And mine happened to be really because of my mother. And 

My mother was a force as gracious, 

gentle, and. Firm as any Irish mother of 11 children could be. And she would go to mass every morning and I wanted alone time with her when I was five or six.

And so I asked her if I could go with her at six 30 in the morning and she let me. And that was that. So as soon as I walked into the church with my mother and she knee down and I looked around, I thought, oh, this is familiar. I was literally feeling like this was home To me. It wasn't a new weird place.

It wasn't cold. I was like, oh, absolutely. [00:08:00] And I remember doing this when I was six, actually, I do remember when I was three years old sitting on the back porch thinking, why do people get to do things 

that they know are wrong and they get away with it?

remember I was three years old thinking, shouldn't there be consequences? So old souls usually have these sort of thoughts when they're very young people because they're in touch a little bit more with what was behind the veil before they left than others. And then I went to church and I watched the priest and I thought, oh, I've done that.

And it wasn't a weird thought to me cuz I was only six. It wasn't like I had any other map that said, that's not okay to think that way. I thought I know how to do that. I knew that. And there were certain gestures he would make that would be not just remembering but compelling. It was a compelling feeling like, oh, I wanna do that.

It was a craving, cuz I know that 

and I loved it and 

so it compelled me into a very mystic connection with the divine. From that point on, I was at mass every day for 20 years, and somewhere around nine years old is when I felt taken out of body. 

When they, at mass when they're doing what Catholics call the change of the bread and wine into 

The realization of the [00:09:00] energy of Christ. I would be particularly taken and then taken out of body. I wouldn't have described it that way at that time, of course, I would just be like, I was with Angels and Jesus 

and I would see the 

world and I would be a kid in a big world.

I would be looking at them like they were doing their thing and I was just looking around. But after a while I was given assignments to be more disciplined in my focus and it allowed me with 10 brothers and sisters, I 

had a lot of 

material. There's like a lot of opportunity there.

So every day it was the little things, are you attached to that cup, then let it go and give it to someone else. But it's, I want to, but I like it, but it's mine. Give it to someone else. Share that with someone else, become detached. And a lot of the discipline was how do you become detached from your emotional preferences so that you can be more loyal to the voice within you than you can be to the situation that ends up outside of you.

So I was constantly under that kind of practice and how do you trust what's inside of you such that if you are saying yes to That's the first priority and commitment that then when you're with other [00:10:00] people and you feel moved to say something and it makes no sense to you. But if you're loyal here, you say it anyway, and then you back off with the results because it's none of my business, because I'm not saying yes to making them feel better or more insightful.

I'm saying yes to the impulse that comes through me to serve. So that's where the loyalty was built over time, and that's 

how I started this. 

 When I was 14 years old, I was at Mass and I heard, and an intuitive intelligence called clear audient, which means that you get your wisdom through words as opposed to pictures or healing.

 I do it through all of them, but primarily through words. And the words were that things would be different. Between myself and spirit at the age of 21, and I was only 14. And I was like, okay, that's bad cuz 

, that doesn't sound good to me. But I just put it in the back burner until it happened.

And then I was 

in college and I turned 21 and I went to a prayer 

meeting that I went to at all regularly at the Newman Center. And 

I had 

no idea what people were talking about. I kept 

thinking, what are they doing? They were praying and I'd been there every single week.

Lots of times I would say something. I came to my turn, I looked around and thought, I have no idea what to say. 

So it was like spiritually amnesia happened and then [00:11:00] everything went dark. the only thing I did say is, did I do 

something wrong? I lost my ability to see through things, into their meaning to hear what was the right thing to say, to be able to see, I lost all of it at once.

And I thought I must have done something terribly wrong. I need to like volunteer more, or I need to be a better person, or 

I probably offended somebody and God's going to smite me. I don't know. But I 

heard .

The gifts that I give to you are not gifts that are, that belong to you. They're the gifts that I give you. So it's mine to give and mine to take away. And I was like, alright, then I get to have this reality. And it's not too different than when people are going along in their life and they're so excited and suddenly they have an accident.

They can't use a limb. And for the rest of their lives, it's taken from them. the way of perceiving and being in the world is gone. They have to do it another way. And we actually go through this. All of us, we go through puberty or menopause or we get married or we, all of it changes everything.

So we all know what that's like to be in a space where, oh, this is one thing and then all of a sudden it's another. And I did have a sort of deep spiritual depression, which is just that all the color went out of the world and the sound went out and it [00:12:00] wasn't exciting anymore. And I was going along, but I couldn't explain it to anyone cuz I wasn't psychologically depressed.

I was spiritually depressed because I missed the connection that I had. And the only thing I heard was when I said, what do I do now? I heard, read the autobiography of St. Teresa Valla Teresa Valla was a mystic in the church. so I started to read her autobiography in college. It was funny because I was on my way home and I was reading it and I missed.

The train that I was supposed to take and I was really mad that I'd missed my train and mad at myself. But it ended up that I read the whole book and I thought I probably wouldn't have read the whole book if I had missed the train. What she described was the dark night of the soul and how when we're maturing, we have to have things that are familiar to us, taken away so that we have the opportunity to see the world with fresh eyes, to begin to define them differently and to find out what a priority or preference would be in a world that has no map, right?

my map of reality had to change. There is no choice. So the question was what is a value in a world where you can't find any value? And that's why I began to 


and my search was what's the fastest way to transform [00:13:00] possible as a human being?

What methodology would help transform this malaise into something meaningful? I was trying to find a way to heal myself. 

And I ended up studying over 50 different kinds. 

And what happened was that my conclusion for that was which is what I studied, was somatic psychotherapy, which is body-centered psychotherapy.

And I learned that the fastest way to transform anything is the gentles kindest, quietest way. We're so used to being blasted and breakthroughs like that, but I found that the gentler and the more accepting and the kinder the intervention, the more 

the body would give way to opening. So that wisdom was more available.

And so that's why I studied Psycho. 

I had 16 months of training, but I never got my license in it. I just needed to get some of the maps down, so in myself so I could understand what was going on and how to help myself and others with that. and then it was a matter of trying to navigate the ways that energy would come to me and through me.

 This voice would come through me or I would start to automatically write what was happening in the future. And I had no idea what to do with this because [00:14:00] my, 

Map of reality was Catholic.

There are no past lives in Catholic. there's a dichotomy. But I have to say, even as a Catholic, I knew I was not a dogmatic person, that I didn't care about the rules. I cared about the Mystic connection. Any church, any faith tradition, I'm Care Jewish and Muslim, whatever it is, the church is there to facilitate that dynamic connection, that individual unique portal between each person in the divine.

And so if you have 

that, then you don't go backwards to saying, did I get seven right on that Sunday? So I started to find out that when energy came through me, it didn't come in a form that I could then say, this is okay with the paradigm you used to have. Cuz it wasn't I'm looking through everything I always relied on and there was no story to help me.

So I had to go beyond the Catholic map, expand my map of reality, which always, when you're expanding your map feels wrong, bad, and you should be ashamed of yourself, that kind of thing. And then you know you're on the right track so the bottom line is I continue to study all of the things I've done and all the things in my mba, in my PhD, all were [00:15:00] about. And my PhD was Shepherding the corporate soul through transformation.

So I combined the energy work with what the spirit of the organization was, because an organization looks just like a person, you have a head, heart, and gut, and they all tell you different things and you're confused, You have the marketing department, you have the hr, you have manufacturing.

They're all telling you different things. It's just a body where corporate means body And so it's about how do you bring all of that into harmony? So it started through that spiritual connection for me. And then it became something that I had to translate into language that was more focused on energy, which took me to some quantum physics, which took me back to how do I define intuitive intelligence?

But at soul level, so 


I do readings, I'm reading people's souls. I don't go to the police and help them find who's missing. I don't tell them what someone on the other side is wearing or what they used to wear. I tell them what their contract was, why they're learning they chose to learn with that person.

What's the purpose of that? So everything, it hasn't changed. I'm just doing priestly work in a different window dressing. So nothing's [00:16:00] changed and everything's changed. Depends on how you perceive it. I love how you 

just said it. I'm doing priestly work. So it's like that priest up there that you knew exactly what to do.

Karen: You're still doing 

it anyway. , I was so fascinated, first of all, by the fact that Carolyn Mis wrote the intro to your book, which. Says right there, how great it is.

But I love the sentence where she said, very few intuitives have been able to make it through the scrutiny of the rational corporate keyhole and earn the respect of people whose focus is business survival. I just thought that was just such an amazing observation a great transition to you talking about your work in corporate.

The fact that your PhD was around sh shepherding the corporate soul through transformation like corporate and soul. I wouldn't put those two words together. 

Therese: In fact, Carolyn was one of the ones that helped me name that dissertation. 

I've always loved business as much as I've loved kind of my spiritual work, and I never knew why, but I could not give it up. I absolutely love business. It makes me happy. I love strategy complexity. I love industry. I did industrial [00:17:00] white papers on industries, and I think because maybe being a mystic, being a person who relates to spirit in a broader way that can go out of body 

business is a beautiful way to be 

able to play human within the confines of a structure someone else creates.

In fact, it's a collective that creates that structure and they agree to it, and they play by their own rules. I find that not only elegant, but I find it so helpful for me because there's the boundary of the map, and if we want to map a new reality in business, we learn the vision, mission, values.

 used to say to CEOs we can talk about your business or we can just talk about you. Either way. The micro macro is the same. The company can only grow to 

to the capacity 

of the leader's consciousness. That's what I've learned in doing large scale systems change for over 30 years.

The fears that 

the leader has is how limited the organization is. And if I can help or facilitate that leader to break through their fear, to open to understanding, loving themselves more and seeing their own [00:18:00] gifts, finding self-compassion, they then come back to their organization with that opening and give 

other people permission to do the same, which allows the culture 

to expand into something that will accommodate and invite everyone's gifts to the table.

I can read from here to Sunday, anything, anywhere, anytime, but I'm only doing it in service of the advancement of their spiritual evolution.

That's my mission. I'm not here for any other reason. So that's what's important to know is how do we help both the organization to understand itself in a more expanded way and to accommodate more contribution and to acknowledge that contribution so it can be enhanced.

Or how 

do we help the leader to open 

out from their fear and move into a place of greater acceptance of themselves, which allows acceptance of their company, which allows more creative strategies to a company that, corporation or that business. We have to befriend our fear, Cuz , there's beautiful things underneath it. But until we choose to be brave enough to face that fear that part of us we don't see. So someone on the outside isn't gonna see us cuz as above below as within.

So without how we see ourselves, [00:19:00] how we're in relationship with ourselves is how others are in relationship with 

us. So whatever we're hiding, 

even if we're not aware of it, they don't see us. It's the foundational piece of how you honor yourself and therefore create your reality and your map of reality 


Robyn: Unbelievable. , so we're gonna just move a little bit to the Rowley method that you've created. when I had my session with you, you are, and granted, I know I'm quite open to all of this, right? And I have some experience with it. However, when you speak to your soul, even if you are, just have the door open a little, then it's so familiar.

, and just speaking about actually what happens, which also you combine. What is going on energetically that our energetic system, in addition to the quantum field. can you talk about that? And when we talk about the quantum field, I know you and I talked about this which is that what some people may call a past life, that's to be determined, right?

Cause it could actually all be going on at the same time. They could be parallel lives, but there are certain [00:20:00] ones that come up a very specific time to help your soul evolve in this lifetime. So 

I'll leave it there. 

Therese: Yeah. I

Exactly. And you had asked about my method and I say I called Rowley mouth because I'm just that creative. I haven't come up with something cool but because everything starts with the individual. The method helps us to understand how to operate our body as a tool, as a companion, as a good friend to the energy of love that wants to be expressed through us.

So first, we learn all of the ways in which we know what we know and honor those. Then we can expand the ways we know what we know and decide that we can use them. I talk about four kinds of intuitive intelligence , that are pretty common and pretty common sensical. I'll give you an example.

I was doing this with my students this morning. You can put a situation that might be difficult for you in front of your third eye, located between your two eyes and down from the ground of your head. It's the one that most people know about. It's called clairvoyance. It means clear seeing. It doesn't mean crazy.

And when you put it out in front of your third eye, the function of the third eye is to tell you the truth. In neutrality, there's no feeling in it. [00:21:00] There are no words in it. It's pictures, symbols, and images. It comes through the function of the eye. It's dreams, it's visions, it's that sort of thing. So when you can put a situation that's difficult for you, it could be with you, could be with you and someone else, could be just two people that you're looking at and you put a two feet out in front of you and close your eyes and look through this portal, this perceptive site and you ask, what's important for me to know?

Or what's the truth of what's going on here? Your third eye can tell you now, you could choose your heart then and bring compassion to that.

You could bring it down to below your belly, in your second chakra, which is your empathy, and say, how do I feel about that? Or you could say, what do I know about this person and situation from my heart? those are all different functions.

Those are all different kinds of intuitive intelligences. So when we talk about the energy, we have to get into things like quantum physics because that's their field of energy and quantum. Physics is trying to make sense of the invisible in a way that the human mind can understand and the logical mind can understand.

And there are many theories because of course you can't [00:22:00] concretize the invisible. You can only theorize it and you can agree on it, you can have many people agree that they see the same thing. You can look at the chakra system because that's what, 4,000, 6,000 year old Hindu system of consciousness that people say over time they have agreed to, that they all see the same sort of thing, so that the vibrations of color and sound and the location in the body are all coordinated.

That's a system of reading. I use it as an overlay. So when I look through something and I see somebody, with a story that's somewhere, it's therefore a reason in that particular part of their body, it's stored in a particular part of their body for a reason. So the chakra system gives you little hypotheses about why that might be there.

Then you can read deeper and more energetically to find out the specifics. But the quantum field says that there is no time and space. And this is so interesting to me because if you go to YouTube, you can find so many people who have had their young kids. In fact, when I was, I was on the Dr. Oz show on the radio show, and the guy who was doing the interview before me was Jim Tucker he did studies of 2,500 children under the age of five who have [00:23:00] remembered their past lives. 

And the evidence that they have is in irrefutable. you cannot say that there's no. Way that doesn't happen because it's been validated, from the facts. And yet, if quantum physics says there's no time and space, then how do we explain past lies?

And incidentally, even being Catholic, at some point I wondered why in the Bible did Jesus ask the apostles, who am I? And they said some people say, you're Elijah. Why would people say he was Elijah. Elijah died a long time ago. Unless they believed in reincarnation.

Why would they say that? All of a sudden it was like wait a second. So anyway the idea is there's a book called and Jane Roberts wrote this trilogy, the Nature of Personal Reality by it was channeled by a guy named Seth. And one of the things he does is he wrote a book on the education of oversoul seven.

And in that book, he talks about how l sends itself out over a timeline so that the discovery of fire. Whenever that was in BC is related to the first rocket to the moon in 1969. And there's a connection and so that these connections have been spun out over a lifetime so that this oversoul can learn about itself, which is a lovely story.

And one way that the human mind can [00:24:00] just simply understand this idea of the temporal in relationship with the eternal And so the only way that I see this as relevant when I'm doing a reading is if I see a story in your field and what you said, Robyn is really relevant because when I tell a story, even if it was similar to another story, it will resonate.

That is energetically resonate with you at a level that you will say yes at a deepest level possible. That's called truth for you. And it's sitting in your field. Even people call 'em past lives, they say, but you're still operating out of the belief system that was born in that particular story. So it's not past it's present cuz you're still operating out of it.

That's unhealed. So I call that 

present and the 

idea is how do we take if you're still operating out of it and it's a fear and we go in and move that fear out and you decide with your free will, that's no longer relevant to my learning. I'm going to learn a different way and a new path and I forgive whatever I've done or whatever's done to me and I move on cuz forgiveness is humanities gift to moving on, then I can resonate with that as an old map of reality and [00:25:00] let go of it and open to new possibilities.

So Then when you look at that field is no longer visible. The picture's gone. The story is gone cuz it's resolved. If you ever saw the TV series Ghost with jennifer Love Hewitt.

Karen: Yes. 

Therese: She would, see between worlds and ghosts would come to her because they were unresolved. She would resolve it, and you would always see them go into the light. You always see this no matter what movie you're looking at. So some consultants are informing these television shows about this and they move into the light because they're finished, right?

With a particular aspect. So that's why when I see people they have completed something and it happens to be, let's say, in an ancestral pattern, they've cleared everything going forward in their generations and everything ancestrally behind them. So it clears because you're brave enough to look into the face of fear and what you're really doing.

The bravest thing that you can do is trust that you're completely and utterly loved. In order to do that, when we release those fears, we have to open to that possibility, much scarier than the fear. Much scarier. 

So that's what it takes to be brave, to believe that we're truly loved unconditionally and completely and utterly and eternally.


the big challenge for 

Robyn: [00:26:00] Yes. and I would say too, we all, I think continue , to need to be reminded of that. Like I may be in a space right now where I know that, but, talk to me in a few months from now. 

Therese: Talk to me in a few minutes from now 

Karen: on any given day.

for those who might be listening to all this and fascinated, can you just talk through then what is a session with you like? Like how do you do it? How do 

Therese: you work with your clients?

And again, what I love to do is teach this so people can do this for themselves. But when I do a reading I am primarily a clair audience, which means I get information through words. I'm not channeling. That's different. If you ever saw the movie Ghost with Demi Moore.

and Patrick Swayze. When Whoopy Goldberg, that guy comes into her and goes, whoa, I love your hair. That's channeling 


she looks at Patrick Swayze and he says, I've got this penny. Tell her it's mine. He says, she's got this penny and it's yours. that's clear audience.

She's repeating what she hears. That's what I'm doing. I'm repeating what I hear. It's a difference. so I know I can get everyone's file by the sound of their name. All they have to do is tell me their name. [00:27:00] And I don't really need, their name, but it helps. it clarifies.

 I always say, tell me your first middle, and if you're a woman, first, middle maiden. Married, however many times did right in a row. Because your name is a mantra, whenever you have a name, people call you that every day. So your experiences rest on your name.

I have done readings from people in United Arab Emirate in China, in Japan, and everywhere in the world. And I can hear the sound of someone's name. And sometimes I'll just say for example, your name sounds like jewelry to me. And I'll say, my name means jewel in my language. So I can hear the intent of the vibration.

That's what that is. So I have then holographic information about thoughts, feelings, beliefs, spheres, et cetera, just from the sound of someone's name. So I don't need to know anything about them. I don't need to know their pictures or touch anything cuz it's all clair audience. but then of course I use those other intuitive intelligences to feel into the field when I'm doing healing.

And that's the other part of the rally method. The first part is just to identify the body as a way to perceive and to receive. Information in the quantum field, which means that ever, all of us are in the quantum field, if we wanna call this [00:28:00] all energy, is the quantum field. And there's a unique signature, like a signature in space, and I'm tuning in through a sound of a name to the signature in space that you are.

And the more you say your name, I ask people to say it three times. It's star Trek, the transporter, the person's almost in there, not quite. So they say their name, and they go, okay, there it is. And when people's strategy for survival is not to be seen, I have to call 'em.

I have to ask 'em to say their name several times because the whole point of their strategy is Don't look at me, don't see me. And so I'm trying to see them and I'm 

going, come on, come see coming. Same with people on the 

other side. , come into this frequency. I can read you.

I'm reading them holographically and I'm still a business person, so I'm looking at objective and deliverable. The objective of the exercise is, I'm having these symptoms. The deliverable is, I'd like to experience life this way. Great. Okay, now I have the territory.

So I'm gonna look into the quantum field, in, into the place in which the root of that fear, and fear-based 

belief are preventing you from moving 

in that trajectory in your path. I'm gonna look at all the stories that keep you holding on to those fears. as I said in the first part we talked about my map reality on bequeathed.

I picked this [00:29:00] family cuz I either feel super safe with them or I feel super unsafe and I know how I need to get outta here. I'm looking at all of that in your field. I can read anything. And the idea is to get to the fear-based beliefs and your essential gifts because typically your essential gifts cover up your field fears.

In other words, if I'm afraid that I don't deserve to be loved and I take exquisite care of you. Because I think you should be taken care of and not me. You're not gonna say, Hey, why don't you explore taking care of yourself? You're gonna go, thanks. 

I'll have some more of that, Yeah, 

Your strategy is working great for me. I'm not gonna question you about that, 

And I'm gonna attract 

people who need to be taken care of. So that's a beautiful way to take a gift and cover 

up a fear. So when they finally get overwhelmed, I can't take it anymore.

Everybody wants this from me. You go, oh, let's look at your feeling of unworthiness. What story binds you that says, no, I'm not worthy, and I vow or promise, never again, that I would allow myself to be taken care of, but I will take care of others. Let's blow that system open and look at that story and then decide.

You can say it's happened. Maybe, three times in 12,000 or 13,000 readings that people have said, no, I don't want to change. And it's perfectly fine. The universe is infinite. [00:30:00] There's no judgment, and patience is everywhere. Spirit is ever patient, you decide it's when you are ready. So it doesn't matter.

. So that's how we do a reading. And then we go to the end. , if it's my clients who have been there, if I get c e o clients and they have one question and they know where they're going with it, we can do a 30 minute session and I can, tie that up.

But typically in first time people, when they're trying to figure all this out, we go to the 90 minutes and then that blows open. Now, if you've been all your life ignoring your feelings, cuz you're a very amazing executive and you get a lot done, you come to a place where life invites you to include self-compassion and mercy and kindness and gentleness and flow, which is not familiar.

So once we blow open this and honor that you have created this situation out of your fear, but what an amazing life you've had and given as a result of that. Now you get to have this if you want it, but now if you want it, Energetically, you're not wired to accommodate that.

 So I give energetic exercises such as, what does it mean to open the crown of your head? open? Allow and receive three muscles open, allow, receive, that most people just don't have. And the greatest skill, I say in all of my practice, the greatest skill is staying.

stay with your [00:31:00] discomfort. Discomfort is a signal that there's some wisdom that wants to be uncovered. Stay with the fear, stay with the things you don't wanna stay with. that's the highest skill you can have in anything, in any relationship, Walk away, no yell back.

No. Stay. Just stay until you get it. Stay until your heart says yes. Stay till the truth says yes. 

That's the highest skill and that's the most important 

skill. . Open. Allow, receive, stay That's not what we learn. We learn to defend, walk away, create, distance.

And we know how to do that, which is great. Boundaries are good. Boundaries are great. I teach boundaries. But we wanna make that choice. Let's stay. Let's see what's transforming. To a place where we're complete when we know we're complete.

Let's finish that then and let's honor what we've had and complete it and then move on. that's how 

I do a 


Robyn: And I can say too, having experienced a reading is that you really do help then, as you said, complete and change the going forward, Because you have honored whatever has been holding you back and so that there's a new contract. 

Therese: that's right. New contract and there is healing. So that's the entanglement in the quantum field. That's the second half of my [00:32:00] methodology. Once you're really clear about how to perceive and how to receive without it impacting your feelings or without falling into the story, and you can do it with some sense of neutrality, compassion, I call compassionate neutrality.

That's what we're going for. And once you can observe that and be in that field, now what you wanna do is be able to respectfully and with permission entangle the other, the highest power you have is asking permission. So it's important because you never wanna decide that because I have a gift and you should have it because I know it.

I have a gift. It has nothing to do with you unless I get your permission, because you are the one that knows if you're ready and want it. And I don't. So it's a relationship. So permission asking is very important. So I'm asking permission and then I'm gonna entangle in the quantum field. Once I'm really solid in who I am and my distance, now I'm gonna entangle in the quantum field.

What does that mean? I don't care if you're in Switzerland or you're here because physics tells us that healing is non-local, that we can entangle in each other's fields without it being physically present. That's part of what we learned from quantum physics. So I can move into entangle in certain parts of the field where I can see what's going on very specifically and how [00:33:00] someone has completely wired their field to accommodate their fear.

How do I then enter that field and release those things with permission? And really then also, I'm telling people exactly what I'm doing. I'm in this part, I'm in this chakra room. I'm in this part of your body. This is how you've wired it. This is why you have stomach this is why you don't feel good in these times, and this is how, okay, so what we're gonna do is we're gonna wire it, but now I understand it.

I don't want to really heal on occasion. I have. Where someone is really in need of being in, er and I just do the healing. But otherwise I want people to understand so that when they get to a place of being stuck again, they can say, how do 

Karen: I do this for myself? That's, 

Therese: it's important for me to, 

Karen: Be able to have agency 

Therese: with how I map my reality. 

Robyn: And I'll say 

too, just having had the session with you, I I feel different. was a confidence and a lack of fear that I have that I notice. And a groundedness in my every day right now in a time where, There's a lot of crazy going on all around me personally and [00:34:00] collectively, and yet, I feel more grounded than I've ever felt. And I was just saying that to Karen this morning. I can't really explain it except to say since our session together and since I've been doing the work that you suggested that I do I have a different perspective and I feel different.

So I feel like there has truly been a new reality mapped for me. 

Therese: you have mapped the reality because you chose to be brave enough to look at your fear to ground, even when there's no evidence that it's safe around you. And the spiritual evolution really goes to one goal, and that is to become more loyal to 


trust that you are here.

To enact a purpose of your own making. And that is, you're loyal to that. And it's akin to this. I have an amazing client who is also in one of my classes. first time I met him, I looked at him, I said, wow, you could go in the front lines of anything and no one would shoot you. see he had protection all over.

He said, I know. That's why I work with the people on the frontline of Afghanistan. I think about how Mother Teresa, 

She walked in the face of war, this little tiny person, and no [00:35:00] one shot her.

Now why? Because she has 

built the presence to say, this is truth. These people matter. 

I will stand for it. And that's so powerful that people with 

big guns aren't shooting, aren't 

saying, oh, forget that and disrespecting it. Because her presence that she has cultivated by trusting unequivocally that she has.

Protected because what she is doing is her mission, and it is more important than her sense of what around anybody else's fears are or what they feel is safe. She's kicking people who are dying up off of the ground. How do you think she feels about that? She 

used to say, do you think this is easy? Do you think I like it?

But her 

loyalty and her commitment and her desire 

to be loyal to that purpose she has was more important and more compelling 

than anybody else's fear. And that's what we're all aiming 

for. We're all 

aiming to get to a place where we're more committed to why we're here and to loving the way we chose to love than we are to bowing to anyone else's fears around us or our own, and to healing those fears so we can continue to love in a way that's absolutely optimal in who we are in this [00:36:00] unique place and time and this unique humanity that we've chosen.

Robyn: I'm gonna ask a question that I know Karen really wanted to ask you. Yeah. Has to do with defining meditation and prayer and if you see them differently or if you see them working together. And is there more power in meditation if you put in quotes, an ask to it? And Karen was asking that because she too grew up in the Catholic church and She was deeply entrenched in prayer. she wanted your opinion on that in terms of meditation and prayer. 

Therese: Meditation it allows us to move into neutrality so we can open to the possibility of everything in life. It clears the field because typically in meditation, you're allowing space for the things that the noise and distraction cover up to be to emerge.

That means that things I'm afraid of, if I keep to my neighbor about their problems or I keep going into social media, I won't notice my fear. And then if I stop and I breathe, eventually the ground swell [00:37:00] comes up and I get to face how I feel that I'm ignoring. And that is another way to encounter our fear.

And the Buddhist would say, simply stay with that fear or that feeling, and be brave enough to stay with it and it will dissipate because all life changes. And so that allows us to heal. Meditation is a great opener. I found it to be helpful in being able to 

perceive things with greater neutrality.

It trains the brain in neutrality, it trains it to value silence and neutrality. And what comes up in the space between words and paragraphs, and because we wanna say, even when we're in what's called generative dialogue and listening to people, generative dialogue is actually to have a conversation with someone where you say something and they wait.

And they say, let me see how that strikes me. They go on the inside and say, this just reminds me of this and this. And they don't know what they're gonna say until they let it go in, and then they say it to someone else and they have to wait. That's generative because we don't know what's next.

So space allows generativity, which is the original creation to rise in us. It makes space for creativity. [00:38:00] Prayer is more active and it's also more partnership based. You're entering a relationship with spirit in a very more sort of human way, if you will. That we know about relationships as human beings and how important they are.

And this is a relationship with spirit that allows our hearts to grow because it's growing inside of a structure, if you will, like prayer 

that says this is a safe place. And this is a place that allows 

us to examine what happens after we feel safe. Because most of the time we walk around in life, many people walk around feeling unsafe.

And you can either be creative or you can be safe focusing on your safety or focusing on creativity. You can't do both. If you feel unsafe, all you're doing is defending yourself. That's what Einstein said. The most important question we can ask is the universe a friendly place?

And if we say no, then all we do is spend our time creating intelligent strategies for emotional survival. And if we say yes, then we get to create from our set sense of safety in prayer. It's a place where we can find safety. And from there we can go deeper. We can go into a place that we trust, and [00:39:00] in spirit, there's always a sense that this presence comes to us that engenders trust and safety, that helps us to 

move from the sense of unsafety to a sense of being beloved.

And then 

from there, all things are possible. 

That's what we call miracle. 

It's the clearing of the space between, what we truly feel we want and all of the reasons why we tell we're ourselves, we're unworthy of it, or we can't have it, or that it wouldn't be good enough So , it allows us to transcend all the distraction and all of the resistance that we have.

And it clears that space and it also gives us the message that. If we're beloved and we truly are beloved, and we feel that we have already everything we need and we're complete as we are, and then go into the world. Here's the thing. If you want that and you're in this place of feeling beloved and you just say, I prefer that, or I like it, that's gonna come to you a lot faster.

 Prayer is really about in the intimacy of loving relationship, the essence of loving relationship.

No matter what happens in a relationship, you're still beloved. And when you feel that and know that it changes everything, that's why people have near-death. Experiences are not afraid [00:40:00] of death because they've been to the other side. And Tekon ha says, there is no death. 

And it's a change of 

frequency. If you're on a treadmill and you have a television in front of you and you keep changing the stations and looking at different shows, and you're going on and you're on the treadmill, and then one day you turn the television off and you get off the treadmill and there you are. And that's what it's like to be dead.

So you don't miss yourself. You're still there. Your consciousness is there. It's just a different window dressing, different costume. So I think prayer leads us to remembering our eternal selves and identifying with it so that when we're out in the world, we're not identified with this temporal self that wants this and doesn't feel good if it doesn't have that, it simply reminds us that if we identify with who we are as an eternal self, that we can be in the world and then love can pour through us without all of the negotiations that go on and stop us and resist us, and don't allow us to simply express it.

Robyn: Thank you for clarifying that and defining it in that way. And last question, which you may say you've already answered, I'm not sure, which is, what is something that people listening right now can do today to start amplifying their intuitive intelligence?

Therese: [00:41:00] good question and two things is 

is to stay, 

is to go quiet inside, relocate your attention in your heart, and just say hello to yourself. Breathe and stay. And you can ask 

any question you want and 

wait and be kind enough to yourself to trust what comes up, even if you don't understand it.

And if, oh, that's a crazy picture I had. Let's think about that picture and just stay with that picture. Stay. Because when you stay with the picture and say thank you to it, it'll start to unfold. It will start to give you more information. It'll start to tell you more. So if you can trust it. And then the last thing is, you quiet your mind, you stay and you trust, and then you act.

If you get a feeling that's it, and you think, oh, that's crazy. I don't need an umbrella. There's no rain. Take your umbrella anyway. Not because it's gonna rain or it isn't, but because you're telling your unconscious mind, I'm willing, you're telling your intuition. I'm willing to trust you.

Even if there's no evidence around that, I should now. I'm gonna befriend me and I'm gonna trust me more than I trust what the evidence is outside me. And that's continual practice until the voice becomes so much louder that you can't ignore it. It's 

two by four. I [00:42:00] take that silly umbrella 

right now and you're like, okay, I'm done this, so you just wanna stay with it until it gets loud enough that it's your best friend and not one of the people you listen to in the world. Oh, that's such good 

Robyn: advice. And I I just wanted to ask you this question too, which has to do with your upbringing and the fact that you did go to mass, you said, every day for pretty much the first 20 years of your life and going to that meditation and prayer question.

Do you feel like during that time you honed in on a practice that most people really don't do? Growing up but you were given those kind of tools and even though it was under that dogma religion it's a practice 

Therese: Total practice and remember that, you're given these opportunities for a reason. This is my work. This is what it came to do in the world. It came to me early to start practicing And 

you don't because that's not what you're here to do. That's right. It's what you didn't jump into a family of, 11 children and a mother who is a saint. I and also I had this incredible opportunity as I went through life for my mother to [00:43:00] make spiritual sense of things to me because she was a really wise woman.

 I have an engineer, spiritual business mind, but people can just come from their hearts and do everything they need to do. And they don't need this, they don't need a method.

They don't need to do what I do. They don't even need to understand any of it. They have what they came to do. And my desire in life is to support people in their essential gifts and in their purpose. Not to help them do what I do. , it's not about becoming more like me because there's totally No. Totally. 

Robyn: Thank you for clarifying that. That makes. So much sense, and you were given that at such a young age on purpose. Just like in my life. My father passed away when I was 12 and a very sudden heart attack, but I know now, right?

I actually realize this in my early thirties, and now I'm 48. That was on purpose, it was a tragedy and it took me a really long time to make any sort of understanding of it, but now I know we work together. He's on the other, whatever you wanna call the other side or in a different field.

Absolutely. That's why I'm doing what [00:44:00] I'm doing today, yes. Because and I needed to have a full circle reconnection with him. In order to say this is possible and there's healing that comes from it, and I want other people to know about it. that's what I experienced, which is quite different than what you did, but that's definitely to amplify my own gifts.

Just as you are amplifying yours, which I am so grateful for your gifts, where does that catch you? Cause some of us need that validation and we need that assistance in seeing it and getting to the heart of it. And I think, we need different assistance at different times in this lifetime.

Therese: We're all needed. Everyone has a different gift because we need all of us, the community needs each other and we're here to share our gifts. We're here to learn about each other and shine back at each other, the mirror that will help us to find our own gifts and to be grateful for whatever those are and bring them to the table and honor everyone's gift, no matter how different it is, no matter how the voice sounds because 

you don't know what a gift is until you stay long enough to appreciate and say, I don't understand this yet, but I'm gonna stay here till I [00:45:00] do. I'm gonna sit at the feet of this mystery until my curiosity leads me to opening it and honoring it. 

Robyn: That's a beautiful way to end today. We have covered so much and I'm so grateful that we are connected and that now everybody listening is connected to you and your work.

And I just wanna say that for more about working with there, find out more about her books and all of her offerings, please visit that's T H E R e S E R O W L E 

Therese: Thank you, Robyn. It's been an honor to be with you. 

Map A New Reality: Discover Intuitive Intelligence